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Bank of America "Customer Service" conversation about Fees (Hilarious!)
Posted by Madethlo on 02/29/2012
ST. LOUIS, MISSOURI -- Welcome to an online chat session at Bank of America. Please hold while we connect you to the next available Bank of America Online Banking Specialist. Your chat may be monitored and recorded for quality purposes. Your current wait time is approximately 0 minutes. Thank you for your patience.

Thank you for choosing Bank of America. You are now being connected to a Chat Specialist. For security purposes, please remember to close your chat window when completed.

Jill: Hello! Thank you for being a valued Bank of America customer! My name is Jill. May I have your complete name please?

You: Marc

Jill: Hi Marc. How may I assist you with your personal checking and savings account today ?

You: Fee dispute

Jill: I certainly understand your question regarding the fee. I will be more than happy to check that for you.

Jill: May I have the last four digits of your account please? 1

You: xxxx

Jill: Thank you.

You: Certainly

Jill: If I understand you correctly, you would like to dispute overdraft fee from your account is that right?

You: Correct

You: Well it is an extended balance fee

Jill: As I have checked on your account, I see that you got overdraft fee for a transaction amount if $620 which is an online banking transfer to your account xxxx when he only balance on your account was $585.30.

Jill: For each time we determine your account is overdrawn by any amount and continues to be overdrawn for five or more consecutive business days, we will charge an Extended Overdrawn Balance Charge of $35.

You: I understand this

Jill: Yes thank you for understanding the process, however, as I see here that there was a previous refund last 2/21/12, we are unable to process any further refund. I apologize however, the fee was assessed correctly on your account.

You: You're fee made the account negative. Then you charged a fee on the fee. That is deceptive business and gouging. I wanted to have this conversation before I pursue further action.

Jill: Once you overdrawn your account pay the fee prior to its 5th business day to avoid getting extended overdraft fee on your account.

You: The account was overdrawn because of a fee. You can't then charge a fee on the fee. Thats preposterous.

Jill: Marc, you were assessed overdraft fee of $35 for your transfer made $620 to you other checking account, and, that overdraft fee remained on your account for 5th business day due to which you got charged extended overdraft fee for that overdraft fee assessed on the transfer made.

Jill: If you overdraw your account, repay the total amount you are overdrawn as quickly as possible and prior to the fifth business day you are overdrawn to avoid this fee in the future.

You: And you did not refund this fee. You refunded another fee that was erroneous to begin with, which is why you refunded it. Then you charged another fee to get your refund back.

You: That transfer was made when there was money in the account to cover the transfer. Otherwise I wouldn't have transferred that amount.

You: You then stuck the fee in there as if it had occurred before the tranfer. Making the transfer for more than what was "available".

Jill: Let me explain the transaction on your account.

You: Then you refunded that fee, because of the ridiculousness of it. Then followed the fee with another on the same lateness. Of course I didn't have the money to put in there. Otherwise I wouldn't have been charged the fee to begin with.

You: I just explained it to you, what is the point of you explaining it again?

Jill: I will explain why the fee was assessed.

Jill: Last 2/8/12, the balance on your account was only $0.40

Jill: Then,

Jill: Last 2/16 there was a transaction for Educational Comp for amount of $182.65

Jill: Due to which your balance went -$182.64 correct?

Jill: Then,

You: Then my check went in

You: before the fee that you are about to say went in there

Jill: You made deposit of $802.91 last 2/17/12 which your balance went to positive $620.30 right?

You: Then I transferred, then the fee

You: Then a second fee for the transfer

You: Then this fee for the extended balance fee

Jill: yes, I would like to inform you that your transaction for $182.65 was an ACH, and all ACH transaction posted on account when there is insufficient funds will incur overdraft fee.

Jill: Yes.

Jill: Then, the balance went below $585.30 before you made the transfer of $620.

You: No it was not

You: It was 620

Jill: That fee was refunded 2/21/12 for your ACH transaction.

You: Otherwise I would have only transferred 585

Jill: Then, you have been charged again overdraft fee for your transfer made $620

Jill: During nightly processing, we process all credits before we present any debits to the account. All debits are then processed from the highest dollar amount to the lowest dollar amount, according to the transaction type, even if they create a negative balance.

You: You do that so that you can get more fees. That is why you process them first.

Jill: I understand why you feel that way. Based on our experience, we believe that many customers prefer that we place priority on their largest transactions when the balance in their account cannot cover all their transactions. This may enable us to pay more important items, such as mortgage or car payments.

You: That has been proved in court to be an unfair business practice.

You: You need to stop using this policy. Or if it is making enough money to keep doing, refund the customers who call you on it.

Jill: I am really sorry if you are frustrated about the fees assessed on your account.

You: Look at the history, your institution has charged me thousands over the years. You might as well refund me so that you can continue to collect, rather than reject my request, and force me to get a different bank to get all that additional revenue.

You: Its just a smart business move.

Jill: Yes Marc, you have been charged overdraft fees on your account several times and we have refunded fees on your account as courtesy. I please suggest you to monitor your account balance to avoid getting overdraft fees in future. I know that paying fees is frustrating however, those fees was assessed correctly and the agreement on fees was included on your personal disclosure when you opened the account.

Jill: If there is anything that I may assist you with please let me know.

You: Refund of erroneous fee.

Jill: I understand however, I am really sorry that fees cannot be refunded and it was assessed correctly.

You: Unfair business practices. I hope you hurry up and settle on this lawsuit. This conversation will be put online and this practice of the extended overdrawn balance fee will also be deamed unfair business practice. I embarrasssed that you are allowed to be called bank of America. It should be Bank of Thieves.

You: Does it say in my account documents that you can charge a fee since I am unable to pay on a previous fee?

You: And the fifteen dollars you charge monthly? Is that another fee?

Jill: Marc, again, we sincerely apologize. The fee disclosure agreement was provided and you were informed about those when you opened the account, and the monthly maintenance fee of $12 was also included.

You: No, when I opened the account, there was no monthly fee. And the overdraft fee was $15. And there was no extended overdrawn fee. This was all added later.

Jill: I can send you the Personal Schedule of Fees so that you can have check all fees associated on your account.


You: Yes, please do.

Jill: Sure.

Jill: Please clcik here.

You: Will it say that if you are unable to pay on one of our fees, we will give you another one?

Last text message receivedJill: Yes that is included.

You: Highly unlikely.
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Posted by Chrissiann on 2012-09-11:
BOA changes their policies as the spirit moves them. I took out a credit card with them for 0% interest until May 2010. By Feb 2010, they started charging interest. I asked them what was going on? They said my interest free period ended Feb 2010. I said oh hell no! I saved the recruiting ad that said May 2010! So they put me back to the no interest until May 2010. I paid off the account quickly and closed it. I refuse to deal with crooks! I will never give them another dime of my business.
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Posted by Chiginc on 12/11/2009
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Posted by tnchuck100 on 2009-12-11:
My reasonable guess would be there is substantial interest to be made each day on $67,000. They have a legal right to hold it for a certain number of days before releasing it. With a check this large they will milk that to the maximum they can get away with. Considering there are many, many other large checks deposited across the U.S. and couple that with their greed and there you have it.
Posted by yoke on 2009-12-11:
Is there a hold on the check? On your deposit slip there should be a day that the funds will be available. AS of today it has been 5 working days. A check that size may have a 10 working day hold on it.
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Let's Put Our Foot Down America!
Posted by Becks13 on 06/29/2009
Don't trust your on line banking. A bank officer even admitted that you can't trust it and that it is not as accurate to the consumer as it is to the bank...then why have it? We are a middle income family that uses our debit card for everything...first mistake. Charges are held for days, sometimes up to a week. Bank of America got us this week for nine $35 fees. They put through the largest item first to the smallest so they could hit us for all nine. I was charged $35 for a slurpee at 7-11 and $35 for a McDonald's hamburger. Our online banking did not show the pending items, only 2 that would put us in the red. We went to the Bank and made a cash deposit to cover our pending 2 items, plus additional funds, yet we were hit that night for 9 items, Today we went in and showed the banker our print out of what was actually pending according to their bank on line, but he responded by telling us the other 7 pending items could be accessed by yet another link, that is not on the main page that shows your current register. Our loyalty or our explanations didn't matter and we were at the banks mercy, there was nothing we could say or do to reverse any of those fees. Most of the items that we got hit on were many days old, being held back until there were nine total they could get us for. Part of this is our fault for sure for not keeping track of every slurpee or hamburger bought, but BofA knows our patterns, and they have us by our check books. They hold back your charges until you overdraw yourself because you think you have a balance according to their bank by phone or on line banking. They told me depending on the charge, it sometimes takes days for the paperwork to come through....yeah right, they know every transaction you make and the minute you make it. They have no mercy, nor do they care if your power is being turned off or you can't buy groceries. Six months ago the maximum they could hit you for was 6 items, but the manager told us today they just raised it to 9, so watch out. America is in the worst shape it has ever been in, and more than 50% of American's live paycheck to paycheck. We need to put an end to the banks stealing our hard earned money. They have many tricks up their sleeves that rip off their loyal customers (25 years loyal) because they can get away with it. They are sitting fat right now while our country is hurting and we need to put our foot down. We should all close our accounts on the same day and give our business to someone else like a good old fashioned credit union. We need to somehow send a BIG message to Bank of America!
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Posted by Anonymous on 2009-06-29:
personally, I feel sorry for any poor sap that has to work for this hobknob of a company.
Posted by Suusan B. on 2009-06-29:
You are the one that swipes your debit card therefore it is your responsibility to not give BofA (or any other financial institution) a reason to charge ou an overdraft fee. The only way to do this is to maintain a balanced paper check register and not rely on the bank to do it for you via on-line banking.
Posted by madconsumer on 2009-06-29:
it all depends on how you used the debit card. if you entered your pin number, it will show immediately to your online account. if the merchant proccessed it as a credit, then it can take up to a week to post.

keeping a paper register is the only way you can avoid any further fees. the online information is accurate for balancing the posted transactions, not pending.
Posted by Anonymous on 2009-06-29:
All banks are doing it. BofA actually has the disclaimer on their website that says they can process the transactions in the order "of their choosing", not in the order that they come in. They are "legal thieves."
Posted by Anonymous on 2009-06-29:
I reiterate: there should be a test before you are allowed to have a checking account. Clearly they are not for everybody.

To the poster, do yourself a favor and go into the bank, and ask them to explain to you how debit cards work, because they work the same way at every bank. If you aren't able or willing to keep a check register, cut up the card and stick to checks and cash. At the end of a year, you can take a vacation with all the money you will save.
Posted by old fart on 2009-06-29:
There is no particularly good reason why anyone cannot keep a check register straight with on-line banking..

For those of you who think it's the banks fault, THINK AGAIN!!
Posted by Anonymous on 2009-06-30:
Think of a debit card as cash. If you don't have any cash in your pocket, you can't make the purchase. Likewise, if you don't have the available funds in your account, you can't make the purchase with your debit card (without incurring a fee). You can't rely on a float to make the purchase then deposit the funds later to cover it. Even paper checks can be scanned and turned into an EFT.
Posted by MaggieMcT on 2009-06-30:
How do you expect the online balance to show checks/debits that haven't been posted yet? Think!
Posted by Alain on 2009-06-30:
I don't use on-line banking. Don't need it. Guess I'm old fashoined, but from posts like this and others I'm not inclined to bother with it. Maybe that's why the banks and I get along usually.
Posted by Anonymous on 2009-06-30:
Man, I hate big government, but they really need to step in and stop this crap. I am almost to the point where I buy everything with cash.
Posted by Becks13 on 2009-06-30:
I clearly understand if you don't have the cash you can't make the purchase, and the use of a simple check register. You are missing the point. Banks like BofA are capitalizing on people who take advantage of the convenience of a debit card. It is easier than going to the bank and getting cash. When you use your card for every purchase including a soda at the convenience store, a register becomes a nuisance. People think they can depend on their on line banking or bank by phone. I have seen transactions appear, then disappear moments later. You can't tell me that with technology today that BofA takes a week to post transactions. It's a scam. America needs to go back to the older days when we only used cash and old fashioned checks with registers.
Posted by Anonymous on 2009-06-30:
Becks, the posting has nothing to do with the bank, it has to do with the merchant and when they batch and submit their debits. BoA gets tens of millions of these each day in great big batches. No one is going through them and selectively holding them; when they receive the file they post it.

Online banking was never designed nor intended to replace a check register; in fact with debit cards you need them more than ever. If it is too much of a nuisance, you have two choices, use cash or accept the fees.
Posted by CrazyRedHead on 2009-06-30:
I don't see anything that the bank did wrong here. You obviously are not keeping a check register. Online banking is not designed to be used solely to balance you checking account, only as a tool to assist. You should always keep a paper register and write everything as it goes in out, and treat pending as immediate. You are responsible for knowing your balance every minute of the day, everyday. I don't find using a checking register a nuisance, actually it's quite the opposite. You will find that all banks manipulate the incoming from highest to lowest, but if you have adequate funds it shouldn't matter in what order they come in. I also agree that one should take a test before getting a checking account. If more people would just do that and read the terms of the account in that little booklet you receive, there may be less problems in the worlds. Oh, and quit blaming the banks on your own inability to manage your own checking accounts.
Posted by MaggieMcT on 2009-06-30:
"When you use your card for every purchase including a soda at the convenience store, a register becomes a nuisance."
Well, if it's more of a nuisance than overdraft fees, you've got nothing to complain about. But, come on, using a debit card for a soda!! Unreal!
Posted by BokiBean on 2009-06-30:
If you're not going to keep your own balance, you're going to have to keep a hefty pad in there so that you don't get stung for overdrafts. Pad the account and then forget about it, don't try to play catchup because its going to backfire on you.

That said, Bank of America is the WORST at gouging their customers for overdraft fees and they are unforgiving.

They've already settled on 35 millar dollar lawsuit about their overdraft practices and lame fees and continue to do it...apparently, the lawsuit was just a drop in the bucket compared to what they can fleece their customers for. It must be extremely lucrative, and they are determined to continue to do it.

Look for a good credit union, they're not out to make the most of your bad situation. In fact, that's not how they do business at all. They will overdraft you, but they won't try to steal your purse at the same time.
Posted by armywife74 on 2009-09-22:
I agree with a poster hatecrooks from another BofA post, many of these people that post a comment to a negative post about BofA are the same one's that have other positive post about BofA on other sites. If I'm a happy customer, I'm not going to go looking online for the company that I'm happy with and see who's dissing them, I could care less cause I'm happy, why waste my time defending their names if I'm not getting paid?
Posted by MaggieMcT on 2009-09-22:
armywife, there's a difference between "defending" the banks and telling people how they can avoid overdraft fees.
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Cashier's Check Hold
Posted by SusieQRealtor on 07/29/2008
LANCASTER, CALIFORNIA -- After being a loyal customer with Bank of America through good times and bad for DECADES, I have finally decided that I no longer will tolerate being treated like a criminal.

I brought in a $5500 commission check from my employer (a long respected local major Real Estate firm) to the local BofA branch I always use on Wednesday 7/16/08 and attempted to deposit it into my account. I requested that it be posted immediately as I had a business trip scheduled for the next day. I was told no, they had to hold the check. I very politely requested access to $1000 as needed about that much for my trip. I was told that a two day hold was required and was referred to "supervisors" who turned out to be the greeters at the front of the bank. After telling my story, one of the greeters took my check and said he would ask the manager.

After a few moments, the greeter came back, looking rather abashed and said it was not possible. I took the check and went to the bank it was drawn on, a local bank a few miles away. That bank took it and cashed it with no problem. The cashier patiently listened to my story. I was so pleased that I immediately opened a savings account. The teller hesitated when she opened the drawer and suggested that I carry a cashier's check back to BofA instead of all that cash, since they "wouldn't put a hold on that".

I agreed, but then asked for $1000 cash, and the rest made into a cashier's check, just to make sure.

I went back to BofA and deposited the check (there was a whole new crew - all very young). After the deposit was made and AS I WAS TURNING AROUND TO WALK OUT, the teller said there would be a two day hold on the check.

I turned around and very loudly said, "You're putting a two day hold on a CASHIER'S CHECK???" Everyone in the bank heard me, and one older woman in line made a wry comment how our money isn't ours anymore. I ranted (no swearing!) about how my husband and I had been BofA customers for decades and I just couldn't see the logic in holding a CASHIER'S CHECK drawn on a local bank when in real estate we regularly transfer hundreds of thousands of dollars instantaneously, why ON EARTH would it take 2 full days to verify the validity of a cashiers check drawn on a local bank that's just a phone call away?

The cashier then rather sheepishly said I had immediate access to $100. I stared at him disbelievingly for a second, stormed out and swore I would close my account and never do business with them again.

After coming back from my business trip the next day, I found 3 NSF charges on my account. I called customer service (what a joke of a name) to request that they be removed due to the circumstances. I was told no. I asked to speak with a supervisor, who also said no, I had been informed of the hold, therefore they were not liable and I had to pay the charges.

I was very upset and told her I couldn't understand their logic, especially with a long time customer. She was very snooty with me and told me she did not have to listen to such language - I had to think about what I had said, it was "damn". I was absolutely speechless. Not only was I being treated like a criminal by my own bank, but I was being lectured on using an extremely mild expletive by some kid??? Then I told her that after over 25 years with BofA with service getting worse every year, I was closing my account and hung up. I think I used the word "hell" in that rant. Bad me.

(On a side note, my husband called them about 1/2 hour later and demanded that the charges be removed and THEY REMOVED THE CHARGES. Does this smack of sex discrimination - they refused to do it for me but did it for him - or just that my hubby is more forceful and browbeat them into it? Who knows.)

I have already been burned by the "biggest first" NSF scam a few years ago. Due to a bookkeeping error that I readily admit, five items came through at the same time, but instead of paying them in the order they were received, the largest one was paid first, which left me with FOUR NSF charges, instead of the one I should have had.

I have found with very little research that NationsBank (one of BofA's predecessor organizations) was involved in a class action lawsuit in 1999 that was settled for $9 million dollars, for this very practice. So they paid a chunk of cash to make the suit "go away", but continue to "help" their customers by deciding FOR us which checks/payments should be posted and which should be NSF'd... Wait a minute... Since they were all paid against the account with their "overdraft protection", why would it matter which order the checks were posted EXCEPT to garner all those unnecessary NSF fees and therefore boost their revenue???

But I digress...

After waiting a few days to make sure everything has cleared, I am closing my accounts with BofA forever. My husband and I will be banking with a local company that actually cares about people and the value of loyal customers.

I am DONE with Bank of America.
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Posted by yoke on 2008-07-29:
It is common to have cashiers checks held. Even my credit union does it. It is very easy to get a fake cashier check.
Why the NSF's? Those items had to have been written before you deposited the cashier check for the NSF's to be there the next day.
Posted by Hugh_Jorgen on 2008-07-29:
I believe most banks are holding all checks these days - there is a huge amount of forged and fake checks floating around the banking world right now - they might look OK to your teller, but once they get to the issuing bank they discover the check is no good.
Posted by Anonymous on 2008-07-29:
So why do some people's deposits get held and others don't? When I banked at Arvest I made several fairly large deposits and never had a hold. After less than two months with my new bank (FNB MWC) I made a 30+K deposit into my account and the funds were immediately available -- I asked. Is there some magic formula or database somewhere that tells them this Joe is okay but slap a hold on this customers deposit? It be interesting to hear from somebody in the Biz on this one.
Posted by Anonymous on 2008-07-29:
My credit union holds checks, too. I think it's kinda standard now.
Posted by Anonymous on 2008-07-29:
The credit union I belong to doesn't hold checks.
Posted by chris513 on 2008-07-29:
Thanks for rubbing it in, steve.
Posted by Anonymous on 2008-07-29:
your welcome.

Ive been with them for a long time,I cant remember if they ever held my checks.
Posted by yoke on 2008-07-29:
My CU will put a hold on a cashiers check for 1 day. I think it is to verify it is not a fake. Personal checks usually there is no hold, unless it is an out of state check. Depending on the amount it can be from 1-5 days. My fatherinlaw likes to send suprise checks from CA and they usually take about 5 days to clear, due to the large amount. I never have a problem with the holds since I know it is protecting the members from fraud.
Posted by BobJohn on 2008-07-29:
"(On a side note, my husband called them about 1/2 hour later and demanded that the charges be removed and THEY REMOVED THE CHARGES. Does this smack of sex discrimination - they refused to do it for me but did it for him - or just that my hubby is more forceful and browbeat them into it? Who knows.)" Hmm, wonder if he 'demanded' nicely instead of getting into a hissy fit?
Posted by Principissa on 2008-07-29:
yoke our credit union is the same way. One business day for cashier's check and five business days for a check of 2500.00 or larger. Everything else is available that same day if deposited before 2:30 P.M.
Posted by Anonymous on 2008-07-29:
My friendly banker suggested that my large deposits be made via electronic funds transfers. They charge a fee for the EFT, but the funds are available immediately if the transfer is from a domestic institution.
Posted by CrazyRedHead on 2008-07-29:
My BOA will put a hold on all checks over $5,000.00 and all cashiers checks of any amount. After the hysterical hissy fit that she pulled it's no wonder that the bank wouldn't lift the hold. If you read the booklet that explains credits and deposits and there schedules it explains all this in writing. If you have adequate funds in your account then it shouldn't matter in which order they come in, and why is it a scam when you can't manage your own account?
Posted by calliope on 2008-07-30:
Customer service representatives get yelled and screamed at on a regular basis by adults. The woman had every right to be upset with your cursing. As a customer service representative I know that part of my job is not being verbally abused. If you are that upset, then you did not have enough composure to listen to what the representative had to say, which renders the phonecall pointless.
Posted by jimbo9 on 2008-09-18:
Can't stand BofA, just read some of the posted comments! All are legitament complaints about this Bank or so called bank. I can't stand 'em. but still use 'em for the low "promotional' gimmicks. And this why... I made a payment on the 5th of Sept. (in person and made sure to get a receipt)the bill is due the 7th on a Sunday. Seems flawless right. Well, I look online to view my account (giving BofA the benefit of the doubt) And saw a $39 late fee? Why???, did it not get updated in the network(computers) to reflect this payment was made? I have a BofA printed receipt in my hands! Boy am I furious and did email 'em today. This is why I became a my3cents member. To add to our love for BofA, I've always used this card with discretion-(very little) ever since I've been a slave and have had a higher % rate. In fact when I first joined I made a couple of simple charges, never received a first statment until well after the due date and then was assessed a late fee? WTF! So from then on I knew I had to watch BofA practices... I could say so much more... And yes, I can pay my bills. and so what if I can't pay the balance every month that's why I have a credit card- And yes there are fees that incur... duh!
So along with most of you, I dislike BofA just as much. We in middle MI have just recently seen these branches pop up. That is when I made a payment in an actual branch and this crap happens... So please try to avoid using this Bank it's only money they care about not practices. besides who's going to scrutinize these guys, they just took on more debt for the Govn't.
It's been a pleasure to vent out loud. Hopefully I'll be in touch soon.
Posted by Anonymous on 2009-06-18:
I love bank of america. However, I do not spend money I do not have, I keep track of my spending, and if I do make a mistake, I do not blame the bank. I blame myself.

It is so easy to fake a check that I don't blame them for holding them. When I accept a check for my online business I hold it too. I don't want to lose out on my money or my items. I bet you dollars to donuts that if you brought a BOA cashier's check to the nice bank who cashed thier own check they would hold it too.
Posted by stan_cooksj on 2010-01-13:
I understand the importance of holding checks. Security and fraud is rampant in this country so it's only necessary. But 2-5 business days is TOO long in our day and age. Bank coporations (ESPECIALLY BoA!!) have the technological ability to check if funds are available almost instantaneously and most banks utilize electronic funds transfers (if non-local), so I know it's not as complicated as they're making it. There honestly should be a mandatory network that ALL US Banks and Credit Unions must be connected to so it makes this hold situation moot and pointless, but banks must be willing to cooperate. It's really just the bureacracy and competition that's in the way. Honestly if a mother needed to cash a check to feed her children she'd have to wait 5 DAYS to feed them!!! Just doesn't seem right.
Posted by Anonymous on 2010-01-13:
"Honestly if a mother needed to cash a check to feed her children she'd have to wait 5 DAYS to feed them!!! Just doesn't seem right."

But it seems right that same mother can be running a scam with those 5 kinds and when the bank cashes the check, by the time they realize the check is forged mother and 5 kids are long gone.

Posted by Anonymous on 2010-01-13:
Can we keep a mother and her starving kids running a scam out of the equation and say what it is, BANK POLICY to prevent fraud?!
Stop resurrecting threads!
Posted by Anonymous on 2010-01-13:
" Bank corporations (ESPECIALLY BoA!!) have the technological ability to check if funds are available almost instantaneously and most banks utilize electronic funds transfers (if non-local), so I know it's not as complicated as they're making it."

When checks are put on hold for any specified time... if a customer wants the hold taken off; it's the tellers (not technology) that make the calls to the other bank to see if the funds have been collected. Now, whether or not the other bank is going to release that kind of information is up to that branch. There's no way to verify if the person on the other line is who they say they are. Again, fraud rearing it's ugly head. Most banks don't disclose any sort of information like that... because of fraud.
There's always the option; if someone needs the money bad enough and the bank wants to put a 5-7 day hold on the check... to go to the bank it was drawn off of and cash the check. Sure, there might be a $5-10 dollar check cashing fee... but it's better than waiting for the hold to drop off or finding out later that the check was bad.
Posted by stan_cooksj on 2010-01-18:
Out of spite somewhat for zzrock (Thank you) I'm going to make another reply. Some of you have no empathy for actual HONEST people who I've come to know and it breaks my heart when these fat cat corps care more about themselves and less about their hard-working and sometimes unfortunate customers that really deserve the break. Yes fraud happens, but that doesn't mean others should be punished for others' dubious behavior. I still think a better option should be in place and technology is the way.

Also, cashing a check in its home institution is difficult if that bank doesn't serve your region.
Posted by Ytropious on 2010-01-18:
"Yes fraud happens, but that doesn't mean others should be punished for others' dubious behavior."....I don't see it as punishment, I'm glad fraud prevention measures are in place. It SAVES you and me, not hurts us. It only hurts impatient people.
Posted by Anonymous on 2010-01-19:
The OP says she has banked with this bank for decades. She tries to get them to release a hold on a check from a respected, local real estate firm. They say "no". The OP goes to the bank the check was drawn on and gets a cashier's check, takes it back and they still want to put a hold on that. They couldn't at least take the time to call the other bank?
My opinion is that this long-time customer was treated like doody. What I don't understand is why the op didn't just use the $1,000 cash that she withdrew on her trip. Why, after hearing "no" for the cashier's check, did she even try to use the BOA account?
Posted by Anonymous on 2010-01-19:
By law, cashier's checks don't get held. That assumes that they are readily identifiable as such. Fraud is rampant with these checks, and many banks are choosing to take the slap on the wrist, rather than thebig loss on the check.
Posted by PepperElf on 2010-01-19:
well it's been a year and a half now... i think the OP's checks have cleared by now... ? =)
Posted by Anonymous on 2010-01-19:
Stan, I am an honest hard working folk too. I don't spend more than what is in my account and if a clients check bounces I do not blame the bank for it.
Posted by Anonymous on 2010-03-03:
Those are SUPERVISORS! Not just greeters they are the managers and assistant managers! They sit up front and greet people to make sure the customer is being taken care of. Next time if you don't know the policy don't throw a hissy fit about it. Good thing for you there was a supervisor/manager up front because my bank there is never a manager up front to assist customers.
Posted by Anonymous on 2010-03-03:
The thread has been dormant for over a month. Note the dates, Rayg.
Posted by Arthur H. Cooper on 2013-12-05:
The OCC (The Office of The Comptroller of Currency, U. S. Department of the Treasury) provides National Banks with check cashing and holding Guidelines, called SC21 which states how and what checks can be legally held and for how long. A CASHIER'S Check < than $5000.00 can be held for two banking days or until validated as a "payable" instrument by the issuing bank. The hold can and should be legally removed at that point. Any longer holding period more than 2 days the bank must demonstrate a legal instrument instruction them to hold the funds. i.e. a Federal Tax Lien, etc.
If your cashier's check is being held after it has been validated as payable by the issuing bank, BOA or your bank is in violation of Federal Guidelines. You can contact the Treasury Dept. Consumer Assistance Group and file a complaint. You can also file aa complaint with the ABA (American Banking Association) Your states Department of State Banking Commission or Division and your states AG (Attorney General). State your case politely referring to SC21 (a very easy to read document any trained chimp or banker can understand). Be very polite when dealing with government agencies. Ask them for their help start the conversation by saying "Please help me!" You will almost never not find a friendly CSR willing to help you. State the facts and hold the drama. I know it's hard when it's "your" money. Just remember, you need their help so do your best. The penalties for bankers are severe. Banned from employment in the banking industry. The fines levied on the banks is nothing compared to the NSF charges they are raking in because of the holds. If you keep between 20k-30k in your account you will never see these problems. However, when your account balance drops below a certain point, your "relationship" with the bank changes. IMHO, you become a powerless "victim of opportunity" in their eyes and they become the predator. Stand up, Speak up and know the law and your rights. It will take you a grand total of about 5 minutes to verify SC21.
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Reshuffle Of Your Dates To Charge You A Fee
Posted by DomCam on 07/20/2008
TROY, MISSOURI -- When you do an over draft Bank of American will reshuffle all the amount for the last 3 days by largest to the smallest, not by date.

Then this will empty your account quicker. I got 5 $35 overdraft charges all of the items were done the day before I the one I should have been charged for. One of them was $35 on a $2.00 charge.

The state and the Fed's don't care. After Enron I thought that we were to have ethics in book keeping. Bank of America has none.

They will give lips service, but not any money back. Also the account did not show a negative balance until the over draft charges.
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Posted by Anonymous on 2008-07-20:
All the banks have been doing this for years. The most notorious of shuffling is to change dues date to a weekend or a holiday when banks don't process funds. So even if you pay on the due date you are still late.
Posted by yoke on 2008-07-20:
If you had enough money in your account to cover all your debits/checks you would not have to worry about the shuffle. I was unaware of the shuffle that banks do until I started reading some of the whines on this board, since I have always spent what is in my account and nothing more. I do not rely on what online banking says. I rely on this thing called a check register, which BTW are free at the bank.
Posted by madconsumer on 2008-07-20:
time to take out your money, and keep it in a can under your bed.

i have been with bank of america for many years. i have never had any issues in the order debits clear. if there is enough money to cover ALL debts, then it does not matter in what order they draft.
Posted by old fart on 2008-07-20:
For golly's sake folks... when your check register shows a zero balance STOP writing checks, put your debit card to bed and quit spending money you don't have..!

Posted by yoke on 2008-07-20:
old fart, if they did that then they couldn't come and complain about how evil banks are.
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BillPay - Outsourced to JPMorgan
Posted by Check Writer on 07/11/2008
In May 2008, Bank of America decided to outsource its BillPay check writing to JPMorgan. Under the new system, JPMorgan cashes the checks on the "Deliver By" date and holds the money until the creditor cashes the check, which now takes 5 days to clear. If the check is lost or the creditor doesn't cash the check, JPMorgan holds the money until the BofA client complains and cancels the check. BofA BillPay executives now expect clients to reconcile their bank accounts by calling creditors individually to ask if they have cashed their checks and credited their accounts. Using the BillPay system, there is now no way to verify that the creditor has cashed the check, because JPMorgan, a third party, cashes the check on the delivery day and subsequently sends its own check to the creditor.

Under this policy shift, JPMorgan in essence creates a buffer fund of cash it can use to earn interest. It holds BofA client money from the "Deliver by" date to the date the check clears, five days after the creditor deposits it.

There are a number of issues that come up with a policy like this. One, bank reconciliation is now virtually impossible. Two, lost or uncashed checks are unknown and can not be easily tracked. Three, in the event of a lost check, the BofA client is still liable to the creditor, even though on a bank statement, it will say that the BillPay creditor check has been cashed. In any other system, if the bank statement says the check has been cashed and the creditor did not cash the check, then one immediately takes action to investigate fraud. In this case, one has to contact BofA to get their money back from JPMorgan, and then investigate if JPMorgan says their check was cashed too.

Everyone should be aware of this policy shift if they are going to continue to use Bank of America Online Bill Pay.

BillPay - Bank of America outsourced to JPMorgan
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Posted by Slimjim on 2008-07-11:
I use BOA billpay and I thank you for posting this informative. I've never had a problem but it is nice to know what is going on in the event I do.
Posted by tnchuck100 on 2008-07-12:
Just one more reason to get shed of these maggots.
Posted by madconsumer on 2008-07-12:
like bank of america did this? they merely outsourced the bill pay.

i do not get the complaint, any time you write a check, the money stays in the account until the check clears.

most people write their own checks, or pay online themselves.

i have been with bank of america for many many years. each time i write a check, the dollars stay in my account until the check clears.

"in the event of a lost check, the BofA client is still liable to the creditor, even though on a bank statement, it will say that the BillPay creditor check has been cashed."

as it is with any bank!
Posted by *Brenda* on 2008-07-12:
madconsumer, you really do not get what his complaint is? Amazing.
Posted by yoke on 2008-07-12:
Brenda, you are so right.
Posted by madconsumer on 2008-07-12:
um nope!
Posted by Anonymous on 2008-07-12:
The great majority of bill payments are done electronically, no checks are evr involved. There are some circumstances where the bill payment company will issue a check because the creditor cannot receive electronic payments. In these cases, they charge your account and mail a check to the address you specified. It works this way with all bill payors. For the number of actual checks involved, I wouldn't be worried.
Posted by Check Writer on 2008-08-08:
Before May of this year, Bank of America sent out Bank of America checks, and the money was taken out when the creditor deposited the check. The "deliver by" date was the date the check was guaranteed to be in the persons mailbox. I agree for people who are just paying credit card and utility bills this does not apply, but if you are using BillPay to send checks to friends, family, local businesses, or any other entity that isn't set-up for electronic transfers, this information is very practical and good to know if you are going to continue using the service.

Who are you banking with anyway? Bank of America or JPMorgan Chase?
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Unfair Fees
Posted by Tropo on 07/01/2008
This won't be news to anyone, but the fee structure at Bank of America is downright un-American. It's clear that they have devised a system to deceive customers into "making" overdrafts they never made.

How it works: Instead of debiting withdrawals and purchases in chronological order, which is, of course, how everyone remembers their transactions, B of A maximizes overdraft potential by processing debits in "largest to smallest" order. This way, one true overdraft can be processed ahead of several other transactions, pushing them into a "virtual" overdraft status. It is a very effective way to exploit people whose income offers little buffer from low balances. We need congressional hearings on this!
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Posted by grandma005 on 2008-07-01:
All the Banks process from largest to smallest debits now. And they do the debits before deposits too. Bottom line you just have to already have the money credited in your account before you go spending. Gone are the days when you can rush to the Bank and make a deposit to cover your debits that you made before your deposit has been fully credited to your account. Days of float is over. Keep a check book and write down every thing that you do.
Posted by old fart on 2008-07-01:
Relying on "check float" is financial suicide and is illegal..
Having enough money in the account is the answer to the problem..
Posted by tnchuck100 on 2008-07-01:
Bank of America does have numerous unethical ways to get your money. But this one you CAN prevent. grandma and old fart are telling you right.
Posted by yoke on 2008-07-01:
It should not matter which order BofA debits your account. You should have enough money in the account to cover all debits/checks.
Posted by jktshff1 on 2008-07-01:
"We" need to be more responsible with the way "we" handle "our" money.
Posted by Anonymous on 2008-07-02:
We should have congressional hearings on whether there should be a common sense test requirement before one is allowed to have a checking account.
Posted by MRM on 2008-07-02:
Thank you, Jktshff, for teaching your readers the proper use of pronouns.
Posted by jktshff1 on 2008-07-02:
you are welcome.
Posted by old fart on 2008-07-02:
It drives me nuts to constantly hear of these "poor souls" who are "victimized" by rhe "heartless" banking industry when they rely on check float, hoping that they can make a deposit before their no-account checks take the inevitable bounce!
Times are tough, but that in no way excuses the fact that living beyond your means is unacceptable.
The purpose of the penalties is to dissuade you from spending more than you earn!
If you want to play that game, the price to pay is in the form of overdraft penalties.
If you don't like it, STOP DOING IT!
Posted by Anonymous on 2008-07-02:
1. Deposit money in your account
2. Don't spend any of that money until your deposit is cleared
3. Keep track of ALL transactions in a check register and balance your account daily
4. Never spend more than what you deposit

If you follow these simple steps, it won't matter what order the bank processes the transactions b/c you will never go overdrawn.

Another tip I picked up years ago was to round each transaction to the nearest whole dollar when balancing my check book - this always keeps a little extra in my account and over the course of a year can add up to quite a bit
Posted by artshocx on 2008-07-10:
um yeah you are all so right. that's why they jacked up my APR for one issue in 3 years that wasn't even my fault.

it all started because, as was my custom, i wanted to pay off my balance. i put in the payment online - it was roughly $3800.00. now i typically check my accounts online about once a week. however i was moving so i had a time period where i could not check my account online AND i had my mail on hold for two weeks and as there was a gap between my old house closing and my new one. two weeks is usually not a big deal, so i wasn't worried about it. appx. 8 days after paying off the card, i needed to make an emergency purchase as moving can be expensive, etc. and did so, since i felt that surely the payment must have cleared by now as they usually clear within 2 business days. after finally getting the computer hooked up, i find to my horror, that although they allowed the purchase to go through, i was over limit by $20 and charged an over limit fee !!! ??? AND that they had a hold on the $3800 payment ??? so i called them and the explanation for the hold (28 day hold by the way) was that since i normally did not make such large payments, this payment was considered to be unusually large and that they held all large payments that were out of character for the payor in question. ???. i calmly explained to the CS agent that the reason i rarely make payments of this size was because i rarely have a balance on the card. AND i calmly explained that if they would have only checked back 7 months ago they would indeed see a similar payment for appx. $4100 which was also paying off the balance after purchasing computer equipment for my business. she informed me that she could not check further back than 6 months LOLOL ???

NOW they did reverse the over limit fee "as a courtesy," BUT then just 6 months later (apparently their memory only works in 6 month spurts) they jacked up my APR ??? !!! when i called in to ask why they jacked up my rate, the CS agent informed me that it was because my account was over limit about 6 months ago. now mind you, i had this card for 3 years and that was the only blemish on an otherwise spotless record AND technically i feel it was a "blemish" that i did not deserve. i was eventually sent to "Custmer Retention" LOL. the CR agent there, was happy to inform me that they could immediately reduce my APR by 3%. oh goody i said, but you just jacked it up 8% !!! so the net balance is still plus 5%. well she said this is all she could do because that was all she was authorized to do, etc. needless to say i no longer have an account with this company.

just because you have one bad credit apple who obviously knows nothing about how credit should be used or maintained, or possibly not used at all, does not mean that the institution in question is blameless - they are all of them sheisters really. i would like to cut them all up, but with the way more and more cash handling and purchasing has to be done online these days, there is really no other option, especially for a business owner, than to at least have one of these little beasts. anyway that is my piece and i have said it. not sure why i even bothered except that it felt good to get that off my chest LOL.
Posted by Anonymous on 2008-08-07:
I agree with your statement and thats exactly what they do. This would not happen to people with a lot of money. It targets those who can lease afford it. They moved my charges around to create multiple overdrafts. If they paid in the order that deducted from my account I would have one overdraft fee. Instead they took most of my check. And they really don't care. They have a scripted response to everything. I hope the bank goes under>
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They Stole The Money!!
Posted by Boa needs your money!! on 08/18/2007
ARIZONA -- I am a caretaker for a 73 year old man that has dementia. He has banked with BOA for years. He somehow lost or misplaced his debit card to his checking account, so I sent him with his friend to the bank to report this and cancel the card. Instead, about 3 hours later, they return home with a new checking account saying that the lady advised them to open. She "closed" the old account that the card was misplaced and just started over. Well, I said at that point, you have a few check out I think. You should not close that account. The bank lady advised me to, he replied. At this point, I begin to look for any checks that were not paid. Nothing appeared. About 2 months later I accompany him to the bank to deposit money into his new account. The teller said you have another account that is overdrawn. He had taken 25.00 from the old account to open the new one and brought home 58.00 that was remaining. At this point, I think this account has been closed. I said that account was closed. She prints me a statement that has a -909.06 balance and hand it to me. What is this? As I dissect this sheet, I find 18 NSF charges from BOA that total 630.00 in fees. Now....this is where I loose it!!

I leave 100.00 in the new account and take the rest of the cash. 2 days later I deposit 400.00 to pay a few bills. When I go to pay the bills, the card is declined. So I go to an ATM where I find a 0 balance, on the new account, which is impossible because I just put 500.00 in this account that was 2 days ago. Well, I go to the bank where the man tells me that they BANK TOOK THE MONEY FROM THE NEW ACCOUNT TO COVER THE CHARGES FROM THE OLD "CLOSED" ACCOUNT THAT NEVER SHOULD HAVE BEEN CHARGED ANYTHING~ because the card was stolen, remember?

I am suing these people and if anyone would like to join a class action suit, please feel free to contact me at altman121@yahoo.com

For future reference, never use BOA!!
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Posted by Anonymous on 2007-08-18:
If you have a debit card, destroy it immediately!
Posted by grandma005 on 2007-08-18:
Putting the card in your wallet does not guarantee the card will not get lost. As a caretaker you should have went to the bank with him. If you had of done this none of this would have happened. You would of known better than to close the account out and demanded a new card with cancellation of old card. If you want something done right you have to do it yourself. You knew that he was not right in his mind so why did you let him go with a friend that had no stake in this? And how did you let it go far enough to get 18 NSF charges? You also knew that there was outstanding checks. Why did you not go back to the bank?
Posted by Anonymous on 2007-08-18:
Please do start a class action suit. If you should happen to win the lawyers will reap millions and you get a new calendar.
Posted by Anonymous on 2007-08-18:
If you want to complain about Bank of America, send a written letter via certified return receipt to: Office of the Comptroller of the Currency, Consumer Affairs Department, 1301 McKinney Street, Suite 3450, Houston, Texas, 77010-9050, Tel: 800-613-6743. Also, send a written complaint to your State Attorney Generals Office, Attn: Consumer Affairs.
Posted by CrazyRedHead on 2007-08-18:
You sent your patient, who has dementia, to the bank alone!!!! Why didn't you go with him to make sure that none of this would have happened?
Posted by Anonymous on 2007-08-18:
I'm with CRH on this. Even though the patient had dementia, does not mean he's not stubborn, and insisted he do his bank business on his own.
Posted by Ponie on 2007-08-19:
My uncle was diagnosed with dementia. Since his brothers and sisters were also elderly, they asked me to become his guardian. A ten minute Probate Court hearing settled this matter. There were no problems with his bank accounts as I had to submit reports to the court. A patient with dementia should not have a caretaker--he should have a guardian. I'm in agreement with CRH and emt_c on this also. You weren't very good at 'caretaking.'
Posted by Dior4Me on 2007-08-19:
It is not easy to take care of your own life and have to take care of elderly and sick people, whether relative or hired caretaker.You had someone take this gentleman to the bank, so you made sure he did not go alone. Banks are like any lenders, cold and unfeeling as a unit. The customer service rep thought that this gentleman had been the victim of identity theft. But they do all kinds of things with charges, etc. You have to go to the bank or call them, speak to a manager, go as high up as you can.They should remove the fees. There is a supervising agency in your state that oversees banks and what they do. Go to your state's website and if you can't find it, call your state's attorney general's office. You can report the bank. Going to their supervisory agency will be better in the long run than trying to bring a lawsuit.
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Deceptive Online Banking System
Posted by on 09/21/2006
Bank of America's online banking system seems to be set up to deliberately deceive customers by witholding current account transaction information.

I had Washington Mutual previously and all transaction were posted immediately - debits, transfers, bill pays - and you could easily manage your account using only their online banking. Bank of America is totally different: all debits, transfers, and bill pays are posted as pending, usually for a day or so, and then there is ALWAYS a period of anywhere from 12 to 24 hours where transactions are not listed AT ALL: not as pending and not as posted - they are not visible.

What it means is that the online banking system of B of A is useless for managing your account, you are forced to use some sort of other register, be it Quicken or a piece of paper. Bank of America could easily make the online system real-time and useful, I know, because Washington Mutual is able to do it. There can only be one reason that BofA does it this way, and that is to deceive people who don't keep separate registers (I do now, because I have to, I didn't have to with WaMu) for the purpose of generating bank fees. There can be no other reason! If there is a legitimate reason, someone please enlighten me - don't say I should have kept my own register: of course with BofA I must, and I do.

Explain to me why WaMu is able to make it realtime, but BofA can't seem to.

Another difference between the two: online bill payments funds are immediately removed from your account and then sent to the payee as a check from a Washington Mutual bank's own account. BofA, when it cuts a check to mail with billpay leaves you responsible for the check until the payee cashes it - again, for no other reason than to generate NSF and overdraft fees based either on a customer's carelessness with their balance or the intenional confusion generated by their online system. I started getting messages like "check #5004 was sent to so-and-so" when I didn't even know I had checks in that range.

Bank of America could easily make things less confusing and clearer, and they could change the way their system operates; again, I know they can, because I've seen Washington Mutual do it; however, they don't, for the purpose of generating fees.

Those of you who want to respond by saying "you should keep your own register" are missing the true nature of the complaint here.

(I'm not a WaMu fanboy, I've seen them make mistakes also, but the obvious deliberate deceptiveness of BofA online banking system is insultingly arrogant)
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Posted by beanbagbritches on 2006-09-21:
I have always had issue with the delay of some payments. It is hard to keep up with the amount I have in my account. Also, the $33 overdraft fee is outrageous! What can you do?
Posted by *Brenda* on 2006-09-21:
This is the reason they give you a check register when you open an account.
Posted by Anonymous on 2006-09-21:
Brenda - as I stated at the end of my complaint, you are missing the point. I have not incurred any fees ever, because I do balance my account. Since I do have a previous bank to compare to, I can see that BofA's method is for the purpose of confusing the customer, and it is for the purpose of generating additional fees. Not everybody will get caught, but some people who otherwise would not create an overdraft situation will overdraw due to the intentional obfuscation of the true record of transactions. And then, of course, there are those who would just overdraw anyway, because they don't know how to handle a bank account.
Posted by glc on 2006-09-21:
Why did you leave WaMu?
Posted by Anonymous on 2006-09-21:
I'm in St. Louis now, and they aren't in this state.
Posted by Anonymous on 2006-09-21:
Here's the deal... when you use your check card, the merchant is placing a hold on the funds. (pending) At a later point, the merchants remits the actual charge. The bank matches the transaction to the hold, and your account is debited and the hold drops. But.... sometimes (for legitimate reasons) the transaction and the hold don't match. This means that you could be debited, but a hold could still exist. For this reason, banks choose an amount of time in which to drop the hold if it is un-matched. It ranges from 24 hours (BoA) to 5 days.

When it is as short as BoA, it confuses people because they think that their balance reflects the debit, when it fact it may not. When it is long (5 days) people incur overdrafts because the hold persists after the account is debited.

The moral of the story is that unless you have access to know what debits are truly pending and which are truly paid, you just cannot keep track of your account by looking at online balances. The need to keep an accurate register not only never went away, it is more important now, than ever.
Posted by Anonymous on 2006-09-21:
ken - the problem I'm having with B of A is different. These are pending transactions that have gone through. Say on day 1 it shows as a pending transaction. On day 2 the transaction seems to not exist - not as a pending, nor as a processed transaction, but, oddly enough, my balance reflects the transaction - the money has been removed from my account. On the 3rd day the transaction shows up as processed.

When I first started with this account, that second day was a panic for me, because I could've swore I saw a transaction for x amount about to go through, but it didn't seem to exist (from the online banking point of view: I could call up someone and they would tell me, yeah its there, but I only get 6 calls a month before being charged for it).

It doesn't have to be that way, they have the ability to make it clearer. In this respect, except for the 2nd day where the transaction disappears, B of A is preferable to WaMu; with WaMu they don't even list pending transactions - maybe if they did the same 2nd day disappearance might happen, I don't know.

The fact of the matter is banks want to make money. If you have millions of dollars deposited with them, they make quite a bit on interbank loan interest with your money. The rest of us help the bank make money by bank charges - it is in the banks interest to get as much money from their customers as possible. One of the ways they do that is through confusion. Banks have changed many of their processes in the last 10 to 20 years to maximize their profit - including, but not limited to processing withdrawals before deposits at the end of the banking day (it used to be deposits and then withdrawals), processing your withdrawals from highest dollar amount to lowest dollar amount (it used to be lowest to highest - the difference is whether the bank charges you an NSF fee for one large withdrawal that couldn't go through or several NSF fees for the more numerous small withdrawals that couldn't go through after paying the large withdrawal first). I find those methods just as despicable, but at least you know the rules ahead of time.

I have been unable to get a satisfactory answer to why my transactions disappear for a day before being shown as processed - I have asked three times and each time I receive this canned response: "Transactions are processed depending on the time they are received
during the banking day. Deposits received prior to the banking center
cutoff time are processed with the overnight processing the same
business day and available for use the following day unless there are
holds against the funds. Deposits processed after the cutoff time are
processed with the overnight processing the next business day, Monday ?
Friday, excluding holidays, and are available the third day.

Please note that the overnight processing begins at 11:59 p.m. All
accounts are frozen with their current totals and we begin the
processing of the days transactions. Processing normally takes two to
three hours. Once all accounts have been processed, the frozen status
is released and the accounts are updated with their new totals and
transactions. In general all accounts are updated by 6:00 a.m. the next
morning. " Which doesn't even answer my question.

They do try to confuse you at every turn. I have a deposit that is being held until 9/21/06. Since the check already cleared, I asked them to remove the hold. Of course, they refused. But what struck me was this statement: "This hold is set to expire on 9/21/06, and the
funds will be available after 5:00 p.m. the next business day. " So even though the hold ends on the 21st, the funds aren't available until 2 business days later. I wouldn't have known that unless I had that conversation with them. Heck, I wouldn't have even thought to ask that.
Posted by taviles on 2006-09-22:
BOA does things to benefit their pocket. The question was why WAMU can do live actual balances and BOA does not. It was not asked how BOA does it.

I tested this one day knowing I was going to be overdrawn. I went directly to the teller and asked her how much was my balance and how much can I withdraw without going over the limit. When I went online it showed I pending transaction of 232.00 my balance was 256.00, the teller stated I could withdraw 256.00. BOA does not care for their customers as long they keep getting the overdraft charges and confusing their customers.

My advise, if you are to stay with BOA, get rid of the checking account and keep the savings. Open an account with your local Credit Union or Bank. You will get better customer service and help. Clark Howard even mentioned to his radio audiences to close, remove your money from BOA. Perhaps this article will explain it more.
Posted by *Brenda* on 2006-09-22:
I'm not missing the point. If people would keep an updated check register then they shouldn't have any problems, pending transactions or not. You say that Wamu doesn't even show pending transactions. In my opinion that would be even a bigger pain in the bum because I would forget that I debited something and only see what was on the screen. I have a BOA account and I don't have the problem with pending transactions disappearing. All of the problems you mention are taken care of by using a check register. It's about taking personal responsibility for what you do; not blaming it on the bank because it confuses you.
Posted by Hugh_Jorgen on 2006-09-22:
I would imagine each bank's data processing system has a lot to do with it. WaMu has grown by adding new branches and has had one computer system that they have been able to conventrate their time and efforts on in order to make it state of the art. BofA has been growing by aquiring other banks and has had to spend a lot of their IT budget on getting different systems to work together and talk to each other as they migrate everyone to their main system. While it makes for a good story, I don't really think BofA is trying to do this just to generate NSF fees.
Posted by Toni I. on 2006-09-22:
Hey robwolf100, I was going to write a comment supporting you and blasting the Bank of America, but then I remembered how you called me a "jerk" in my Boycott CITGO report (http://www.my3cents.com/showReview.cgi?id=15926). Because you are such a putz, I'm actually glad that you are getting screwed by BOA!!! Why don't you try blaming President Bush for your problems with BOA?
Posted by Ponie on 2006-09-23:
Posted by Pamy on 2006-09-24:
I have been using Online Banking since 1997. I have no problems with it and my bills were always paid on time but lately it seems that BoA intentionaly debits your account knowing that you have NSF so they can charge insufficient funds fee. And be very careful in making an ATM deposit. Some dishonest ATM Teller claimed that I deposited only $30.00 instead of $120.00 saying that the $100.00 bill is a $10.00 bill so I kept calling(Wells Fargo) and because of this error they charged me an NSF for $33.00. Because of the numerous calls and e-mails they reversed the fee and the credited me for $90.00.
Posted by Vessigny on 2006-09-26:
My husband also had some of these same problems. Never again with BoA. Unfortunately, my silly stepdaughter started with them and is already getting screwed royally. So much for her learning anything from her parents.
Posted by BofAsucks on 2006-09-26:
I agree and sympathize with what you have posted here. I recently opened an account with BofA, and it has brought back many bad memories from the past.

You are right, BofA doesn't care on little whit for customer service, their whole operation is a (barely) legal racket set up to systematically steal your money in the form of fees, charges, and any other scam they can think of. My advice, switch banks immediately, and NEVER do business with them again.
Posted by CheshireCat on 2007-02-26:
Boycott Bank of America for giving credit cards to illegal aliens. Why are they giving credit to people that don't even have Social Security numbers? How Un-American! What do you think about paying higher interest rates to people that may go home and default? What about people that are not traced by national credit trackers like TRW? Sounds a little unfair to us Americans. What do you think about the illegals getting special and preferential treatment over you, the American citizen?

Take your money out of the Bank of Illegal Aliens.

Join the Bank of America Boycott at


The man organizing it, William Gheen, is at http://www.alipac.us


Don't be the last American with your money in that bank!

Posted by Nate222 on 2010-12-02:
I've got a problem with the same tactics. If you pay a check using the online system it will show as pending until the check is actually delivered to the payee. Once that happens the payment is just listed as "processed" along with all of the other payments. Some are subtracted from your balance and some not. That check essentially disappears until the payee cashes it. Like a ticking time-bomb. My problem isn't keeping track. I now keep a paper register. You have to. As a means of keeping track of your money the system is absolutely useless. Absolutely useless. My problem is the promotion on the site itself. "Know Your Balance" "Keep Up To Date" "Track Your Payments" Etc. The site really comes across as... really promotes the idea that, you can actually "do your banking" online. You can't. The system is set up to play you for a fool. It promotes something that it doesn't do. If there was a bold headline reading something like, "You can make online payments here but you have to keep a paper register!!" it would be closer to the truth. I'm thinking about filing a complaint under Massachusetts Consumer Protection law which is pretty strong. Chapter 93A.
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Where did my money go?
Posted by Wvhilgal on 03/17/2005
With their online banking, you see your daily balance on one part for the date, at the top you see your available balance, and there is a section that will show anything pending, such as check card purchases. Last Tuesday I see a checkcard purchase pending. I deducted this amount from the daily amount and it matched the account balance to the penny. Next two days, pending disappeared, showed up 4 days later and taken out again. So what happened to the first day when the available balance showed it had been deducted???

Also used their online bill pay and my cable company never received the payment.
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Posted by KenPC on 2005-03-19:
Hello, although this looks tsrange to you, it is probably exactly the way it should be. Here's how it works:
When you make a debit card purchase, and swipe your card, an electronic message is sent to your bank, telling them you are buying and the amount.
Note, this may be the exact amount, or an approximation. For instance, if you are in a restaurant it isn't the final amount, since you may be including a tip. Also interesting to note that gas stations always seem to submit for justa dollar. In other words, they are just checking to make sure it's a real card.
When your bank gets this message, they send back a response that the account is good, and the funds are there. Then, they put a hold on those funds, since in effect you have already spent that money.
When you saw your AVAILABLE balance decreased, you were seeing the hold go on your funds. Your actual balance never changed.
In 1 to 3 days, the real charge comes in to the bank, and at that point, they decrease your ACTUAL balance, and the hold disappears. This is why it appeared to you that you were debited twice. You really weren't. At the end of the month, your statement balanced, I bet.
In regards to your bill pay, when you submit a payment you get a confirmation number. If you contact your bank with the number, they can trace the payment. The reality is that it it most likely that your cable company fumbled it.
Most bill payment services offer a payment guarentee, so if it turns out that BoA screwed up, I would expect them to pay your late charges.
One last thing, I dont work for BoA, actually I work for a credit union, but electronic payments work the same way everywhere. I hope this puts your mind at ease.
Posted by lavonne74 on 2005-03-20:
The same thing has happened to me.
Posted by cojcj on 2005-04-11:
KenPC is correct that when the card is used as a credit(pinless) transaction it will show in pending as an authorization hold and yes it will reflect out of your "available balance" at that time. You are also correct in that it does dissappear. BofA does not keep it shown out of the balance like other banks I use do. The authorization is only held out of the balance for the first 24 hours (approx) or over the weekend if it were transacted after cut off time on a Friday. Your available balance will go back up until the funds are actually posted to the account and collected by the merchant which normally takes 1-3 business days. This can be considered both a good and/or a bad thing considering how you look at it. It's bad for those customers that do not keep a transaction register (even though they should) because it can confuse them on what the actual balance of their account is. A good thing for an instance such as staying at a hotel and only spending $90.00 and then the hotel authorizing $150.00 like so often I have seen done. I would like to be able to use my $60.00 and not have it on hold for 4 days or so. Also resaurants, clubs, bars, car rentals, and such business will often authorize for higher amounts as well.
So yes it may appear to be taken out twice but in actuallity it was only collected and posted to the account once. I would suggest using the card as a debit(when you put you 4 digit PIN number in) when ever and where ever possible. It will stay shown on your account from the time it is transacted on the card until it is collected and posts to the account. Remaining out of the available balance the whole time.
As for the online billpay not being recieved that could be a result of many different things. Couldn't really suggest anything on that except just call the online banking department of BofA. They would be able to research that for you.
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