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Overdraft Fees
Posted by Overdraft on 05/13/2008
CHERRY HILL, NEW JERSEY -- I have been a customer at Commerce Bank for less then a year now. I have had nothing but problems with them from the start.

To begin with, my pay check is direct deposited into my account on Thursday at midnight. If for any reason, a check clears the account on Friday, they bounce it. Yet, I can go the ATM and take out any amount of cash I choose on Friday.

Also, my biggest complaint is the fact that what I see on line is not what they see in their offices. There have been numerous times wherein I have received a NSF fee and there are no negative balances in my account. The little note they send you to inform you of this "overdraft" states that my account is negative.

I check my account every morning. I do not see any negative balances. Yet they somehow find a way to create one and charge me $35.00.
I have called the bank on numerous occasions. To no avail. They state that the balance does not matter.

I have even gone as far as to write letters to the President of Commerce Bank Dennis DiFlorio.
For anyone who is interested his email is dmd@yesbank.com.
I did get some relief from him as he did refund my fees on 2 occasions. But after that, it was a losing battle.

I have also filed a complaint with the Comptroller of Currency in Texas.
If anyone is interested in a class actio suit, please let me know. They are really ripping us off

     
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Posted by Suusan B. on 2008-05-13:
Posted and available funds are two different animals. It sounds like you are relying on what the on-line service says is your balance and that is always a mistake. Banks are not going to charge you a NSF fee unless your account is overdrawn at some point in time. It is your responsibility not to give them the opportunity. I would suggest you maintain a paper check register where you keep track of every transaction and make sure it is kept balanced so that you never, ever authorize a debit without making sure you have the available funds to cover it.
Posted by tander on 2008-05-13:
I've always been told not to go by what your account balance is online, like the other poster said balance your checkbook by using your check registry. If you are keeping track of your balance yourself and not relying on your account online, it should balance out and you shouldn't have overdraft charges.
Posted by Anonymous on 2008-05-13:
I don't want to come across rude, but I just have a hard time believing it's a banks fault when someone goes overdrawn. We have too many tools to keep track of our money in today's world and the best one yet is to simply keep a ledger and keep it updated daily. Some people can't save up 6 months of excess cash, so even if you do live paycheck to paycheck, you don't have to go overdrawn, you just need to be that much more disciplined.
Posted by yoke on 2008-05-14:
Why are you writing checks before your deposit? What your bank may be doing is paying the check that comes in before your deposit as a courtesy to you and then charging the fee. Would you rather the bank bounce the check and then you will have to pay both the fee from your bank and the fee from whoever you bounced the check to.
Posted by Anonymous on 2008-05-14:
What is the date on your pay stub? If it shows Friday's date, then your deposit is effective on Friday. If Commerce posts debits before credits (like many banks do) then a check clearing on Friday will, indeed, overdraw your account. For a check to clear on Friday, you'd have to have written it before the funds were deposited. You play the float and get burned. Bank wins.
Posted by Anonymous on 2008-05-14:
Accumulating 6mos worth of living expenses is very good advice, Dr. Who. I would encourage people to start a more modest plan...save one week's worth of expenses, then two weeks, then three, etc. Trying to save 6mos of one's net earnings seems daunting. Take it one week (or even one day) at a time. Overdrafts, unless they are a bank error or result from theft, should never happen, and would not if Dr. Who's advice was followed.
Posted by Super CCS on 2008-05-21:
There are four different kinds of fees that banks charge Customers.

NSF: Non Sufficient Funds is when your posted balance goes negative due to a paper check, electronic draft check, or an ACH debit. Commerce will charge for $35 fir each item that brings the account to a negative balance and return the items to the presenter.

OD: Over Draft is when your posted balance goes negative due to a paper check, electronic draft check, or an ACH debit. Commerce will charge for $35 fir each item that brings the account to a negative balance however in this case they paid the items that were presented.

The next two charges are the ones Customers just do not understand because by what they see online is that their account never went negative. The negative balance has nothing to do with the fee. It is the availability of the funds.

UNC: Uncollected Funds Fees are charged when a Customer writes a paper check or makes an electronic payment using their bank routing number BEFORE they deposit their paper check at the bank. If the check you deposit at the bank is drawn off of another Commerce Bank account you WILL NOT be charged the fee. If the check is drawn on lets say Wachovia, the funds from the Wachovia check deposit are not available to pay the paper check or makes an electronic payment using their bank routing number that same day. Even if it is a Payroll Check, Government Check, Certified Check, Cashiers Check, or a Money Order. Commerce makes funds available the next day to pay those items, not the same day. UNC items are PAID not RETURNED.

UNA: Unavailable Funds Fees are charged when a Customer writes a paper check or makes an electronic payment using their bank routing number and there is a HOLD on funds either from floated paper checks, ACH debits, electronic draft checks, levies or liens, or the most common one unposted checkcard holds. UNA items are PAID not RETURNED.

When you check your account online or by using the telephone automated service, or even with live CSR agents the paper checks that you may have written and sent out are not available for anyone to see. Commerce Bank business day runs from 6am to 6pm Monday thru Friday. At 10pm every evening Monday thru Friday is when the “system updates” there are specific sequences that are used by the bank unfortunately paper checks are the last item to be processed during the update.

That is why it is important to keep an accurate check book register of all of your transactions. Check book registers are one of the last free items that bank gives away so there are no excuses to why you can’t keep records.
You can not just blame Commerce Bank for fees. Every bank charges fees. Banks have become warehouses for money. What goes in each month usually goes out that same month. Look at the interest rates that banks offer for savings accounts and money markets. Believe me they are not able to make any money on writing loans and mortgages.

The bottom line is this; Keep accurate records it’s your hard earned money.

Banks are FOR PROFIT BUSINESSES!


Posted by tnchuck100 on 2008-05-21:
Super CCS, unfortunately you are not being totally honest and forthcoming about HOW the bank will find a way to assess those fees in sneaky ways.

If you keep a meticulous check register it is most likely done in a chronological order. As transactions are made you make an entry in the register.

The bank, however, does not do it that way. Check your agreement and you will find they can process transactions in any order they desire. Most banks will process debits (largest to smallest), then deposits. This provides them the best opportunity to hit you with a fee. This WILL maximize their profit.

One other thing that now happens is the bank does a "reverse float". Just like we used to do with checks and it was illegal. But now the bank does it and it's legal. You deposit a check. By law they may hold it for several days depending on certain conditions. They might clear that check within 24 hours but may not post it to your account until the must by law.

The bad part is it is virtually impossible for you and your check register to track the processing the bank is doing. Unless you are fortunate enough to keep a large balance they are going to help the poor get even poorer.

Most credit unions, on the other hand, post transactions to your account in the order they receive them.
Posted by Bill4 on 2008-08-07:
I have to agree with the poster. I have been with Commerce for almost 15 years and didn't start seeing this crap until a few years ago. I don't mind getting overdrafted when I do somethig wrong...but they hit me twice if they are two different things...like if I bounce a check and some gas goes through the same time...they charge me $74 (which they stopped doing for a while and just started again). I think that is wrong...because I overdrafted the account one time technically...not twice. I was told it didn't matter how many different things caused the overdraft...you sholdn't be charged twice. I stopped fighting with them because they got so big that they don't care about the customer. BUT, if they screw up something on your account you get nothing but trouble. They withdrew $1500 twice from my account because the teller was new and didn't knwo what they were doing and I had to wait a weekend without access to that 1500. Once it was all done and said they offered to send me $10 "voucher"...I was like WHAT! I overdraw my account by a few dollars and you charge me $37 and you screw mine up at the tune of $1,500 and you want to give $10!!! Commerce has changed over the years and they have a poor training program as I also will get a different reaon/answer from as meany people as I talk to on any givin' situation. Sometimes they even admit that it changes from branch to branch and depends where you open your account...etc. Oh ya, just to say I also have had them baffled once when I went in and told them to show me where my account went negative and they couldn't. They were just reaching and the lady would point to a number and say "That is what caused the overdraft", then I would point and say, but it is still in the positive...then she would try another number..same thing...no negative...she got so frustrated she pushed the papers across the desk and said "You wll have to go to your branch and talk with then". I don't knwo how other banks are, but I have been thinking of changing for a few years now...but they know how tied in your bills and everything is...so they bank on you not wanting the hassle (no pun intended). Well, if anyone kows a customer friendly bank...let me know! Happy Banking :-)
Posted by Betterlife on 2011-06-04:
The process is called reordering, and it is illegal, commerce has commonly been known to practice bad banking habits. All banks do it, just look it up online about class-action lawsuits. Overdraft a class-action lawsuit is already underway, look up the firm that starts with Kopelowitz in Ft. lauderdale, FL. Keeping a paper registry is of no help, the bank will always take your charges from largest to smallest especially if you have multiple charges in a day. In addition to the bank can at will hold funds for no reason to let other charges come through. At the end of the day they are the ones actually in charge of the way your transactions post regardless. After I had a commerce employee tell me that the banking system allows you to steal my money and charge me for it, I have moved to cash and try to use my card as little as possible. This is also an excellent way to save. I've been with commerce for six years, and I'm glad most of you have had no problems apparently, but the banking industry pulls in 40 billion dollars a year based solely on overdraft fees. That is a lot of irresponsible people I guess, or maybe some large banking giant is trying to continue to make loads of money.
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Avoid Commerce Bank NA (KS/MO)
Posted by Owlie on 02/27/2010
MISSOURI -- I have banked with Commerce for well over a decade. In the last two years, however, their service has deteriorated to the point where I fired them and went with US Bank.

1. Good luck finding a live knowledgeable person when you call the customer service 800 number. After jumping through multiple hoops, you will eventually reach one. I suggest calling twice if you want to compare what you are told. If you have lots of time, three times is even better.

2. The ATM card they gave me worked at every ATM in St Louis and surrounding areas.... but not at any of the five Commerce Bank locations I went to. You can imagine how much I was charged then for transactions. When I requested a new card that would actually work at one of the Commerce ATMs, they sent me a Visa check card.... in my deceased husband's name (he wasn't on my accounts). After multiple attempts (see number 1 above) to reach a live person, I was issued a new ATM card. Oh wait, no... no, it wasn't... it was another dam Visa check card which I specifically stated that I did NOT want. (They charge you $1.50/month for this thing.)

3. I used Bill Pay, alleged to be free, a few times. Oh, it's not free.... I was charged $6.95/month for it. This was reversed when I stomped into a branch and spoke with a VP guy when I cancelled the checking account three weeks ago.

4. But wait, there's more! The VP guy did NOT cancel my account as requested. He just cancelled my ability to look at the account on line. He also did not return my phone calls when the check I was told would be mailed for the balance did not arrive.

5. I ended up cancelling it by writing a check to myself for the balance. I was told by the teller at the drive-up window yesterday: "You can't do that." I said "Give me my money now." She did.

Good-bye Commerce. You will not be missed.
     
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Bank elsewhere
Posted by Max0 on 02/04/2010
I am an attorney writing in complete disgust as to the way my client was treated at this bank. In order to prove her case, my client requires her bank statements from 2007-08. She needs them by February 17, 2010. My client went into the branch in December 2009 to request them. She did not have her old account number with her, but gave her social security number and name. After weeks of following up, she returned again on February 4, only to be informed that they could not locate the account without her account number. If she had known that in the first place, she would have immediately returned with her account number. Regardless, she proceeded to provide them with her account number on that day. She was told that it would take another three weeks. She then put me on the phone in order to notify them that this was unacceptable, that she needed the statements by February 17, 2010. I notified them of the dire consequences to my client if she did obtain the statements by that date. They were unsympathetic and stated there was nothing they could do. I suggested that she ask them to at least write a letter confirming the existence of the account in 2007-08, which branch managers do all the time. Without explanation, they refused and stated that the same people who would take three weeks to research her old statements would take three weeks to write the letter. They suggested to her that she call customer service. She asked them to call customer service, since they are supposedly there to serve her, and they refused. They then threatened to remove her from the premises because she was taking up too much time and they were unable to assist the other customers--not because she was unruly or belligerent (which she was not), but because she was taking too much of their time! I find this the most appalling of bad customer service stories that I have ever heard. Not only did the branch refuse to write a letter confirming existence of an account, which they do all the time, but they then threatened to remove a customer from the premises because she was politely demanding that they correct their own mistake. Unbelievable. I urge all to do their banking elsewhere.
     
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Posted by goduke on 2010-02-04:
Here's a couple of questions, law dog.

Why did you and your client wait until a month before trial to ask for these records? We all know that there is a huge lag time in court cases. There's no way you just figured out you needed this.

Why not just ask the court for a continuance? Courts do it all the time.
Posted by Anonymous on 2010-02-04:
Why would it take 3 weeks to get a bank statement? All they needed was a history, right? Why wouldnt the bank provide their customer a history? I used to work at a bank and it took me 30 seconds to pull up an account, closed or not, and print out a history. This seems like a valid complaint. I surely would not want to bank with a bank that treats their customers in this kind of way.
Posted by goduke on 2010-02-04:
The 2007 - 2008 records for closed accounts may already be archived. It's possible that they have to be pulled up from at a data processing center rather than at a bank terminal.
Posted by Anonymous on 2010-02-04:
They must have some crappy software at Commerce Bank, then, if it takes 3 weeks to do it. Unless the tellers don't have access to things like that and they have to send a request or something like that to corporate. But, even that sounds like a real headache.
Posted by goduke on 2010-02-04:
It's also probable that they have to be certified in some fashion to be utilized as court records. The bank may require that to be done centrally to avoid any possible impropriety.
Posted by Anonymous on 2010-02-04:
There are Commerce Banks all over the country that are unrelated, so it would be nice if you specified which one.
Posted by goduke on 2010-02-04:
I wonder if the lawyer billed his client for writing this....
Posted by Anonymous on 2010-02-04:
Wait until they get the bill for these statements
Posted by saj80 on 2010-02-04:
Bingo, Ken; I'll bet it's several dollars per page plus a research fee.
Posted by Wow on 2011-06-04:
First of all certification for something like this would take less than an hour, finding an archived account can be done with your social security number, my account with commerce has changed, but all the bank records from my old accounts are attached to my new ones. I've dug up account statements from 5 years ago in a day.
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Mislead to Keep Account Open, Then Charged Late Fees When Told Not to.pay
Posted by Tlynnjeffries on 01/04/2013
KANSAS CITY, MISSOURI -- I have been trying to resolve this problem for over 2 months now. I called to close the account and they stated, "you still have an Expedia credit for $50." I kept it open and charged a hotel, expecting my refund on the next bill. It was not on there. I called and was told that offer never existed. I do not have any other cards, so I know that is not true.

I was told they would investigate it and get back to me, that I should wait for the new bill to be sent. When the bill arrived there was no refund and a late charge was added. I called back 3 times and each time was told that I had to talk to the supervisor that took my information and she would call me back since she is always off when I call. I still have not received a call. My payment is due in 5days and I'm sure I will get charged again for a late payment. This is the worst customer service I have ever experienced. I feel violated and disgusted.

     
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Posted by trmn8r on 2013-01-04:
If I were you, I would always pay my bill even if I were in a dispute that makes no sense, and get it back later. In fact, if the dispute makes no sense, it heightens the importance to pay it, IMO. Otherwise you can be confident they will hose you. I suppose you may get late fees and interest back, but personally I don't like to see my credit compromised even for a few days or weeks.

The key question is, do you have a statement showing the $50 credit, and that it went away?
Posted by Obsfucation on 2013-01-04:
You should be more concerned about the latye payment showing on your credit report. As Trm suggests, pay the bill then duke it out with them.
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Commerce bank is tricky
Posted by JuliMO on 05/26/2012
MISSOURI -- I agree with you that commerce bank is tricky. I have been with them for about 6 years and they will do everything in their power to overdraft you. I have had debits appear in the pending section, then disappear and reappear in processed section a week later more times than I can count. If you put a deposit in and go spend the money they will always process the debit before the deposit and the tellers are always rude when you call them. I also have problems with their monthly charges. Mine always come out on random days (meaning it could be the 20th of the month or the last day, their is no scheduled day) and it will always be when you account reaches under a certain dollar amount as if the computer is set up to take it out when its about $15 and you make a purchase. The $10 monthly fee (which I think is b. s) comes out before the debit every time. also these monthly fees just started appearing out of nowhere. I signed up for free checking and when I called up to ask why is there service charges the teller just played stupid and said "that's how its always been" keep in mind I had been banking with them for nearly 4 years at the time. I don't really understand how they can change the agreement that you signed up for but they did. I mean really is that even legal? Isn't there a law that says you are grandfathered in? If you are banking with commerce (or comi bank that we jokingly call it in our house)I would recommend keeping a check book and documenting your spending, don't rely on their online banking. In my opinion it is designed to overdraft you, not help you. And as far as people on here saying you should have "X" about of dollars in your account at all times, not everyone has money to leave in the bank. I single handedly support my family and live paycheck to paycheck so these $35 to me is a lot when I have food to buy or clothes for my child so please don't be so condescending.
     
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Posted by Suzy on 2012-05-26:
Past time to change banks. Try a credit union, you do not get these types of mysterious charges/fees only overdraft fees unless you've signed up to have no overdraft protection.
Posted by trmn8r on 2012-05-27:
No there isn't "grandfathering". However, I am fairly sure they must give you notice of the change in fees. If my bank went to a fee, I would look for a new bank as Suzy suggested.

As for overdrafts, all banks will look to make profit from them - this is part of their income stream. That sounds nefarious, but it is true. The way to avoid being penalized is to keep a sufficient balance to cover the peaks and valleys in items that go out.

It took me getting whacked with only two overdrafts to figure a new way - I keep a buffer at all times to cover the unexpected. Problem solved.
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Bank will not investigate wrongful charges
Posted by Steew171 on 11/13/2011
GARDEN CITY, KANSAS -- I had a $30 charge appear on my checking account which I did not authorize. The only detail on my bank statement was a phone number, no company name. So, I called the phone number, it turned out to be a call center for various companies, and they told me that in order to reverse the charge I would have to know which company charged me. I told them I had no way of knowing who charged me, my bank statement didn't give that info. They put me on hold, then disconnected me. Obviously, a scam company and bogus charge. So, I filed a dispute form with Commerce Bank in regards to the charge. The result was that Commerce bank would not reverse the charge. Their reason was "I could not identify the company that charged me". What in the world!! This bank is so incompetent that they can't even determine who charged my account fraudulently ??? And then they blame me for that ??? It's the bank's responsibility to tell me who charged my account!!! And, they couldn't even do that. This is the worst bank that I have ever seen.
     
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Posted by momsey on 2011-11-13:
This might be also difficult because of the lack of a business name, but have you filed a police report? And keep bugging the bank until they reverse the charge.

And, I'd think about closing the account for security reasons.
Posted by steew171 on 2011-11-13:
Honestly, I shouldn't have to file a police report or extend a lot of time in dealing with this. Every other bank that I have ever dealt with, would simply reverse the charge unless the company issuing the charge could prove it was valid. And you can't tell me that Commerce Bank can't trace back as to who got the money. In this day and age, that's mandatory in fighting crime. This bank flat does not care to do their jobs as they should.
Posted by momsey on 2011-11-14:
Right, but it is your money and whether you should or shouldn't *have* to do one thing or another, it's in your best interest to do what you can to get your 30 bucks back.
Posted by CowboyFan on 2011-11-14:
Why don't you telephone the call center and ask them the names of all the businesses that could have billed using the call center number? Then report those names to the bank.

The other question is how that company got your bank number so that they could charge you? Does anyone else use your account? What were the companies you buying from back around the time this happened? Could one of these companies forwarded your account number to these people?
Posted by steew171 on 2011-11-14:
If I file a police report, the police will simply call the bank and be told the same thing. "We don't know who charged his account". I'm claiming they do know. I found out that if I close this account, and another charge comes thru, Commerce will still consider the charge legit and automatically re-open the account and charge me an od fee for each time they try to debit my account. I would say that speaks volumes for why Commerce is not investigating, they simply want to try to rack up fees on me.
Posted by steew171 on 2011-11-14:
I'm sure it was on the internet as to how they got my info. When I call the call center they state that they cannot give me the name of the company because they represent too many. And, being crooked, why should I think they will cooperate as to giving my any assistance with the proper names? When they state that they will get someone to help me, they put me on hold, then disconnect me.
Posted by Slimjim on 2011-11-14:
Totally agree with stew on this. How are you suppose to know who is charging fraudulently. Doesn't that kind of work against crooks if they disclose that? IMO, this bank does not handle disputes at a level I would expect.
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Rude and Harassing Collection Procedures
Posted by Gilbeckemeier18 on 09/27/2011
I have been with the Downtown Branch of Commerce Bank for about 8 years or so.

I have my VISA Card with them, and a high credit limit.

For two consecutive months I have not received a bill on my Commerce Bank VISA, and it has nothing to do with the Post Office because I have NEVER had a problem with them, and ALL my other mail and bills have arrived timely.

Please Note: The people at the St Louis Downtown Branch are wonderful, friendly and helpful and very responsive, especially Jan Robertson. I have absolutely no complaint about them.

HOWEVER, Kansas City is apparently staffed by quite a few "jerks" who seem to care nothing for your problems when you call them.

EACH TIME they have failed to send me my VISA bill, they have tacked a $35 charge for "late payment" when they did not provide me with a bill. They haughtily tell me they sent it to the address I gave them, but the bills have stopped coming, and no one there seems to care. They obviously would rather dun me $35 each time they fail to provide me with a bill.

BUT that's not the worst part, although I am demanding they remove the two $35 charges.

They have been calling me every day just after 9 AM and usually just before 9 PM, though tonight it was at 7:13 PM and they left a message to call their billing/collections department. I called back at about 9 PM and after wading through their voicemail system I finally got through to a human being. I didn't raise my voice or use any bad language, but I told the lady that they seem to have a policy of harassing their customers until they have thoroughly demoralized them and bills get paid just to stop the harassment. She abruptly told me she didn't have to take that from me. I didn't use curse words or raise my voice, but she hung up on me.

THEY are the ones who keep failing to provide me with a bill, yet they hit me with their late payment fees and the irritating phone calls. If they call me early in the morning (let's assume for a moment my payments are legitimately late), do they somehow think I can have a payment in their hands in Kansas City that evening. What is the purpose of the evening calls if not to harass?

They may think they are within the parameters of the applicable federal collection statutes, but if they keep it up, I am going to file a lawsuit against Commerce Bank here in St Louis seeking actual and punitive damages for the intentional infliction of emotional distress. And I'll have one of my friends file it, but actually, I have been trying jury cases for 35+ years, and this one would be like falling off a log.

Judging from some of the other complaints I have read tonight, they have a real problem in their Collection Dept. and in other departments in Kansas City, and they ought to try to be understanding and helpful rather than sarcastic, supercilious and rude.

I am now done, but I hope all the people out there who have had problems with the sending of their VISA bills, unjust and unfair late charges, and complete rudeness when the customer calls seeking help, will write my3cents.com and share their experiences. Gil Beckemeier, St. Louis

Tonight, when I called them back and finally got a human being,
     
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Posted by At Your Service on 2011-09-27:
As frustrating as it may seem, you can still be held responsible for any charges or payments even though you've never received a bill.
Posted by leet60 on 2011-09-28:
If you owe a monthly payment, and are not receiving a bill, you should call and inquire why and determine the payment amount due and submit it. Not receiving a paper bill does not make the payment no longer due.
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Scam Banking
Posted by Mindygirl01 on 12/15/2010
KANSAS CITY, MISSOURI -- Today 12/15/10 I have been running circles for 3 1/2 hours with Commerce Bank. I first got this account because my employer Carondelet Health had this banking firm come to show us what they had to offer etc. I switched so I could get free money orders as this is was to be a free benefit, and how I have to my pay rent. Secondly the so called overdraft protection. I check my account online religiously and then come to find out I have 6 overdrafts totaling almost $200.00 and nobody at Commerce is willing to help me. When I made a deposit yesterday I was told I had a credit balance of $191.00 by the drive thru teller and found out the same night when I was making another deposit to my account is overdrawn by almost $200.00. I feel like they are putting the screw to me- here it is Christmas and they could have ran thru the 6 charges, and just gave me 1 overdraft but they choose to loose a customer to try and make a profit off me as I already work 4 jobs trying to meet my needs.

I tried to Speak to Branch Manager at 135th an State Line- she was doing an audit in vault so I was sent to 135th and Lamar- Branch Manager out, went back to 135th & Stateline Manager was still in vault audit, went to 89th & Stateline spoke with manager in training to hear sorry about my luck, and then I went back to 135th and State Line to hear her say she wouldn't help me, then I called online banking ad s last resort to hear sorry.

This is how they care for there customers - Good way to wreck someones Christmas.

     
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Posted by momsey on 2010-12-15:
Did you have six charges that exceeded your available balance?
Posted by CrazyRedHead on 2010-12-15:
If you did have six charges that exceeded your balance then the bank didn't wreck your Christmas, you did. I don't use the online system, telephone, or bank teller to keep track of my balance, only to know what charges happened to come in over night. I keep a checking register to keep track of my balance.
Posted by leet60 on 2010-12-15:
" I check my account online religiously..." This is the biggest and most common mistake I see in those that post here with similar banking problems. Your online balance is NOT reliable, nor is the balance at the ATM. The website, nor the ATM have a record of any outstanding transactions that have not been presented. It only takes ONE to bring you into an overdrawn status.

Get a checkbook register and keep it religiously. Write down EVERY transaction whether an actual check, debit or ATM withdrawal and do the math to determine your balance.
Posted by Anonymous on 2010-12-15:
All depends leet. Mine does. The only transactions that are not posted instantly and reflected in the balance are checks (of course).
Posted by Anonymous on 2010-12-15:
Agree with incred. Both my credit union and my bank post transactions immediately as pending until finalized and they are withdrawn from my available balance. The only thing I have to remember is to subtract any checks I may have written. I don't keep a check register and rely religiously on my online account status and never have a problem.

Do yourself a favor and find a bank that follows this practice. There are still banks out there that care about doing right by their customers.
Posted by clutzycook on 2010-12-15:
I do the same thing, just. I usually write no more than one check per month (and that's a busy month). The rest of the time it's cash or debit. As a result, I haven't kept a checkbook register in almost 5 years but I've never overdrawn (come close, but a miss is as good as a mile).
Posted by Anonymous on 2010-12-15:
I haven't used a register since the 80s. I did not know they even printed them still. I don't recall seeing one in my last box of checks.
Posted by jktshff1 on 2010-12-15:
I use a register. Just for my own peace of mind.
Posted by trmn8r on 2010-12-15:
I don't use a register, never have. It works if you are the kind of person who can put up with it. My mom spent hours each month balancing and looking for $0.56 (eg), and I vowed never to do that.

What I do is keep "mad money" buffer in my account - $200, in case unexpected items come in (remember I don't use a register). This also helps when I make a deposit and have items coming in. I never plan to use funds from a deposit for at least 2 days.

You can use a larger buffer, say $500, if you have more activity. You spend about $5 a year in lost interest for the protection.

Or go to PNC bank. I just opened an account with free O/D protection from a linked interest bearing account. Win-win!
Posted by Venice09 on 2010-12-15:
I don't like balancing a checkbook either. Back when I as single, I just rounded the numbers off to a higher amount in the register, which makes it a lot easier. I stopped doing it that way when I got married and had a joint checking account. I didn't care though because I wasn't the one balancing the checkbook!
Posted by trmn8r on 2010-12-15:
I keep my register mentally. Really. I used to round up also, and just gave up altogether. I guess I still do, to the nearest $10. Nobody else has their paws on my checkbook though, and I don't buy stuff with my debit card. In the words of one consumer, "I like to keep things simple."

With my buffer system, I "check in" every few weeks to make sure I haven't made a serious error.
Posted by momsey on 2010-12-15:
I keep a register just to write down checks I write. I've never balanced a checkbook in my life, and I have an MBA in finance.
Posted by steew171 on 2011-11-16:
It's true, you have to keep a register with Commerce Bank. With most banks when you use a debit card, some type of pre-authorized transaction will show on your account instantly. But, not with Commerce. I've seen some debt transactions sometimes take half a week before they appear on my account. Makes you wonder why that is. Since that info. has to go to the bank, otherwise you wouldn't get an approval when making a purchase.
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Suddenly Charged Maintenance Fees On Account
Posted by JuliMO on 08/24/2010
DESLOGE, MISSOURI -- I have been banking through commerce for nearly 5 years and have never overdraft or had any mistakes on my part. I recently got charged $7 for a "monthly maintenance fee". I called and talk to my local bank and was informed that everyone was sent a letter telling them (which I did not receive). She said you have to have $500 direct deposited into your account every month. Next month I received 4 direct deposits of about 200 each and the fee showed up again so I called again this time she said unless you get one direct deposit of $500 or more in a month then you will now be charged this fee "because of the cost to send out bank statements every month". What is that like. 50 cents? Then give me my other 6.50 back you crooks. I contacted them via email and never received a response. what is this saying? If you are not rich then they don't want your business.

THIS COMPANY IS UN AMERICAN!!! How can they change my bank account terms without my permission. I signed up for a "free checking".
     
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Posted by goduke on 2010-08-24:
Well, since the government cut off the free for all on overdraft fees and such, the banks are now scrambling to find other ways to "fee" themselves into profitability. I fear the concern you raised is only the beginning of a trend.
Posted by Weedwhacked on 2010-08-24:
They're not "Un-American". American companies are in business to make money every way they can. I have an account with Bank of America and noticed a maintenance fee after I moved from Chicago to Atlanta. They told me it was because my direct deposit had stopped (of course I left my job in Chicago.) When I called to inquire about the fee the agent removed the fee and waived it for the next three months. In the meantime my unemployment started coming in as direct deposit so I'm no longer being charged.
Posted by Obsfucation on 2010-08-24:
GD is correct... everyone wants lw interest mortgages and high interest on their investments. Remember, back in the Carter days when overdraft fees were $3.00, mortgages were 18%.
Posted by Anonymous on 2010-08-24:
I would go and tell the manager you will be shopping around for a new bank account.
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Overdraft Fee & selective posting of debits
Posted by Stop Overdraft Rap Off (SORO) on 08/17/2010
KANSAS CITY, MISSOURI -- I have had an account with Commerce Bank since 1984. I never had problems until May 2010. May 1, 2010 my Visa was stolen and used. I went to Commerce to stop the use of the card and get a new one. An investigation had to be conducted which would take about 3 weeks. Commerce Bank did advance/replace the money stolen. But that's when the nightmares started. I was having issues with creditors. May 17, 2010 I call Commerce to inquire about stop checking payments. I was told that eack check would be $30.00. I requested (2)stop payments $60 on May 17, 2010 and one on May 29, 2010 $30.00. The bank sent checks thru any way. I went to Commerce on Blue Ridge Blvd and request a restriction be put on the account, they continued to send the checks thru. Each time I was charge insuffient funds and return check fees. Several time the account got up to $892.00 This went on week after the stop payment until May 29, 2010. That same day I went into the bank at the Plaza Office and request that my account be changed. When I was write a check the bank would not pay as your debits came in, they choose to pay the largest down. I disagree with that, if I send a check in on Friday it gets to the bank on Monday along with an ATM purchase that came in on Monday. I feel the account should be debited the way the tranaction come in. Do not rearrange the order in which the debits came into the bank to warrant adding an insuffient charge. I sorry to be rambling on, but I am really upset by the way my account and myself was treated in this matter. Finally Commerce Bank locked my account after receiving my direct deposit without notication. I had to wait all week before I could get them on the phone. I had to take off work. Wait until 9:30 am to get to talk with the Manager of the Plaza
Eric something who informed me that he had closed my new account because of to much activity and insuffient funds in 30 days. I did have direct deposit. I do owe a balance of $234.16 to Commerce Bank because of all the insuffient fund fee and all the return check fee charge after I $90.00 stop payment was paid. I was told by a Commerce Bank representative that the creditors had the right to be paid. WELL AS A CUSTOMER, WHEN I PAY FOR A SERVICE. I have the right to get what I pay for. Not get charged continuously with a double wammy for something I paid to stop. That bank employee is paid to due a service, not be anyone financial advisor. The comments and thoughts should stay to herself. It turns out I paid a total of $90.00 to Commerce Bank to stop payment and the checks kept going thru from May to the end of June or first of July.
Should this get looked into because it happen to a lot of people, I'm on board with any action that takes place. It's just not right Commerce just disregarded to 26 year that I banked with them.
     
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Posted by skelly39 on 2010-08-17:
File a complaint with the OCC or FTC, whatever body governs that bank. They mishandled your problem from day one. Good luck to you.
Posted by goduke on 2010-08-17:
You might also want to contact your state's attorney general's office so that they can look into it.
Posted by saj80 on 2010-08-17:
After the recent ruling against Wells Fargo, in which they lost a court case related to how they processed items and charged overdraft fees, I believe that more banks will either be looked at or will change voluntarily to avoid the negative press. This type of structuring items cost Wells Fargo $207 million, and got the attention of many other banks. My bank used to process items in this manner, but stopped as soon as the lawsuit became public and before the judgement was announced.
Posted by grandma005 on 2010-08-17:
This is why I use a credit card instead of a debit card.
Posted by Obsfucation on 2010-08-17:
Saj, I think you may be mistaken. The lawsuits were against 3 of the large banks, WF, BoA, and one I can't recall. The complaint was not in posting order, it was that they failed to adequately provide notice when their processing changed. There was kind of a no fault agreement, and they coughed up some dough. In point of fact there is nothing illegal about processing in this manner, as long as it is disclosed.

When you think it through, the processing order has no impact on the depositor at all, if there are collected funds in the account when the check is negotiated. (or the debit) It is actually illegal to be issuing a check when the funds are not in the account. It's a little disingenuous to accuse the bank of something illegal, when in fact it is just the opposite.

Not all banks process in this order, most do, but ALL banks re-order the transactions in some fashion. It is the only way accounts can be procesed. Transactions do not come into the bank piecemeal throughout the day, they arrive in big batches of thousands or millions of items.

It would be interesting to know why the bank paid the items that were stopped. There are specific laws that spell out the responsibilities on both sides. If OP placed proper stops, then all they need do is go into the branch and inform them that they paid stopped items. Some additional information about these items, and the timing would be interesting.
Posted by Anonymous on 2010-08-17:
Actually the law suit was against only Wells Fargo ( VERONICA GUTIERREZ, ERIN WALKER, and WILLIAM SMITH v. WELLS FARGO BANK, N.A.).

Anybody interested in learning how truly deceptive WF and big national banks in general really are should read the ruling in this case. A real eye opener.

http://graphics8.nytimes.com/packages/pdf/business/20100811-wells.pdf
Posted by Marvin on 2011-06-04:
Actually the law suit was against WF and BOA, but those are just the only two to actually have paid something. And the lawsuit was based on the process called reordering exactly what most banks do. Which is why most large banks have class-action lawsuits filed against them. Soon all banks will be paying some of the 40 billion dollars they accumulated in these fees back. The court found this process to be more damaging to the everyday client.
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