NYC, NEW YORK -- I worked at JetBlue JFK for two years and I can tell you that I won't even travel on the airline myself unless I can carry on my bags. The public view of the company doesn't not reflect the reality. The Pilots are highly professional and the mechanics sure know what the heck they are doing. But as far as baggage and customer service is concerned, there is much to be desired.
Bags get lost on connecting flights for several reasons and I will list them here for you. On connecting flights the bags are removed from the aircraft. In theory transfer bags should be loaded separately from destination (JFK) bags, but that isn't the case about 20% of the time. So what what happens, the bags are loaded with JFK bags and next thing you know they're on the carousel for JFK instead of being staged for the connecting flight.
If the plane is running late you can pretty much kiss your bag goodbye. It will be left at the ramp in which the plane arrived until a supervisor or someone who gives a hoot observes the bags out of place and notifies a manager.
Another thing that is important to note, a lot of the employees don't really care about your bags (not all I have observed many highly professional baggage handlers who are keen on making sure bags are not left on the ground). If the bag is properly handled, then it it sent to a staging area where transfer bags are supposed to be picked up for the flight, but again the concept is great on paper but you got to have people who care about their job.
So what happens here, about 30 minutes before a flight is to leave someone has to come over and ask for bags for their flight. If they don't the transfer agent has to contact the lead for the flight to pick up the bags. If communication breaks down the guess what the bags are still on the ground about 2 minutes before the flight leaves then what happens. The manager states to get the flight out without the transfer bags. And bada bing, the bags don't make the flight.
What you do have is a don't care attitude among the employees because they know their supervisors never have their back in any matter. I worked the transfer area and when I was there, we had improved the departments performance over 95% (mind you rain, snow sleet did not matter this was a 100% outdoor operation). However, because JetBlue is known for not taking care of the ramp staff (a bit racists maybe), a lot of staff just don't care about your bags period.
I can only talk about my shift which was PM and nights, I can't say much about day shift but on those days that I did work on day shift, I have observed guys sleeping in the baggage cart on top of the bags that had to make a flight. I have seen bags that were on a belt loader that needed to go to another gate. But when a person tries to do the right thing he/she gets shot down. Now they have a new terminal and hopefully things are better but we will see with time. Oh well happy jetting.
BURBANK, CALIFORNIA -- JetBlue refunded ONLY AFTER served with court papers. On July 2008, I bought a JetBlue Airways package for two costing $610.00 online. The package included flight + hotel for 4 days and 3 nights from Burbank Airport to Las Vegas. We arrived 1 hour early and were told that the flight was cancelled due to bad weather at JFK. The flight was cancelled even though there were four JetBlue planes on the Burbank Tarmac because they were using the plane from JFK to Burbank to continue onto Las Vegas.
They could not accommodate us with another flight and we opted to have all monies returned to my credit card. The receptionist only returned the flight portion and told me to call JetBlue Airways at 1-800-538-2583 for the hotel portion. Since we did not arrange for transportation home, we had to take two buses and walked home the rest of the way which took us three hours.
The JetBlue representatives at the 1-800-538-2583 were rude and robotic. There are reasons why women are put to handle customers' complaints because they are supposed to act mindless. I spoke to three different women and they all said the hotel portion was forfeited and we should be grateful that JetBlue even refunded our flight portion. I was livid that JetBlue was keeping my money when I did not even get to stay at the hotel.
I wrote to Mr. Barger, CEO, at the corporate office in New York. I did not get a response but a hotel refund for only one night was credited to me. My question is if they could refund one night, then why didn't they refund the full hotel portion. It took them four months to give me a full refund and only when I consulted an attorney and filed a small claims against them in November. The attorney contacted JetBlue with a written letter to pay the balance owed to me in 14 days.
For a big corporation like JetBlue, they try to rip customers off. Since I did not hear from them, I filed small claims in December. For those of you who don't know how to serve Corporations such as JetBlue, go to http://www.sos.ca.gov/business then click California Business Search on the left hand corner -- then next to Corporation type JetBlue Airways. Then click on JetBlue Airways (in blue) and you will see this:
JetBlue AIRWAYS CORPORATION. Number: **. Date Filed: 7/17/2000. Status: active. Jurisdiction: DELAWARE. Address: 19 Old Kings Hwy South Darien, Ct 06820. Agent for Service of Process: National Registered Agents, Inc. 2875 Michelle Dr Ste 100 Irvine, Ca 92606.
This is how you serve them with court papers. When they got served, they contacted my attorney to say that they credited all the monies back to my credit card. Since they did not make payments within the 14 days time frame, I took action to sue. JetBlue had four months to do the right thing but chose to ignore people like us.
Since I had already filed the court papers, I told my attorney to let JetBlue know that I would still go to court to have my case heard. However, JetBlue didn't want a judgment against them so they agreed to refund my court fees because it would cost them more to send their representative to court. In the end, I did not sue them for any compensation, only for money I spent and rightfully deserved!! If I can get my money back, you can too.
LONG BEACH, CALIFORNIA -- On 17 December 2008 our party of six Australians (3 couples) were traveling with Lux Coach Lines Los Angeles to Las Vegas. It had to turn back because highway blocked by snow. After advises from your company we could be accommodated on your Flight 282, Dept. time 13.21 if we arrived in time or on Flight 286 Dept. time 15.50.
Lux delivered us to Long Beach Airport at 11.30. AM & for $507 cash I purchased six tickets for Flight 282. This flight was cancelled, no reason given but no plane sighted & we were given tickets for Flight 286 same loading area. We were advised Flight cancelled due to snow at Las Vegas Airport, but later Flight could still go but had to move to another loading area. As we lined up to go through security again we were advised flight also cancelled. We then returned to your Airport desk to change tickets for December 18th 2008. We were advised we were on Flight 286 & told if we came before 11.00 A.M. we could be on Standby/Wait Listed for earlier Flight 282.
On 18th December 2008 we were at Airport 10,30 A.M. & after luggage checked in, we were advised we were on Standby/Wait Listed for both Flights 282 & 286 & told advises we received the previous day were incorrect as both Flights were sold out & other passengers from 17th December were also on Standby/Wait Listed & we could not be guaranteed on getting on either Flight.
Offer of JETBLUE credit was declined as no used to us. We were then advised cancellation fees would apply (it was JETBLUE that cancelled Flight 282 Dec. 17th) & were offered $417 for our of $507 & being stuffed around over two days. I accepted the offer so we could get on with our trip but then advised we could not receive cash even though I paid cash & cash was available, it could not be credited to my Visa Credit Card but I would have to wait 6 to 8 weeks for a cheque to be sent to Australia. This will cost me $35 in Bank fees to negotiate if & when received & I will not have use of funds until cheque is cleared if your company is still operating.
The only positive to come out of contact with your company is the effort your employee ** made to resolve the situation on 18th Dec. & retrieved our luggage. She was understanding & patient. COMPARE JetBlue TO LUX COACH LINE SERVICE, LUX feeder vehicle picked us up at 6.45 A.M. & delivered us to Anaheim Depot at 8.30 A.M. At 9 A.M. we left for Las Vegas & were turned back at 10. A.M.
They provided us with alternatives which included offer from your Company. They provided these option: (1) Travel with Lux the next day; (2) Would drive us to Long Beach Airport, we could take up your offer which they did at 11.30 a.m; (3) They provided full refund for fares paid; (4) They provided drinks & snacks for passengers.
It may have been unprofitable for them but I am sure they will receive benefits in due course for the manner in which they dealt with situation promptly & decisively. JETBLUE cancelled Flight 282 on 17th Dec (no reason given) took us nowhere, gave us nothing, stuffed us around over 2 days & charged us for this privilege (Cancellation Fee). Refused to refund our money but did give a promise to send us a cheque in 6-8 weeks.
NYC (JFK), NEW YORK -- I can't imagine what happened on 08-08-08 for Jet Blue airline. I was flying home from JFK - New York City to Pittsburgh on the above date. Got to the airport only to find my flight was going to be delayed by 3 hours. As I looked around the Jet Blue Terminal and started to have conversations with other passengers I realized the whole system was out of sorts. People were laying on the floor, curled up on chairs trying to sleep etc. (being stranded for up to 9-10 hours already) and why I found out, was a delay in the whole system. Planes were ready to go but had no crew. Crews were ready to go but had no planes.
Scheduled flights were canceled to various parts of the country, leaving many passengers stranded, looking for alternative planes with added costs for moving. People with babies and children. Announcements were few and far between. I was routed from Gate 6 at 11:45 pm to Gate 15 at 10:35 pm to Gate 18 by way of shuttle bus for 11:15 pm. People passing by in the shuttle bus line were hysterical at the inept service. Many people had been shuttled back and forth between gates several times as their gates were changed.
Whew, what a seriously defective way to handle a misstep on the airlines part. Some people said it was weather related, but as we searched our laptops and called homes we couldn't find a single incident of really bad weather anywhere. Over the years I've been in planes that have taken off in storms, winter ice (with planes de-icing more than once) fog, turbulence. So if there was a weather related delay on 08-08-08 no one could find it.
I would think it was a total domino factor. One delay by a late crew or a faulty plane would set the tone for the complete ruination of a travel day. My biggest complaint is the lack of communication on the part of Jet Blue staff. The way we found out our flight was leaving earlier than the info. board said was by one of our group checking online through her phone. There happens to be a customers Bill of Rights by Jet Blue that says the following: "Customers whose flight is delayed for 1-1:59 hours after scheduled departure time due to a Controllable Irregularity are entitled to a $25 Voucher good for future travel on JetBlue."
Not one of us was offered this compensation. Our flight was scheduled to leave at 8:35 pm and didn't board until after 11:00 pm and wasn't able to take off until after midnight. We were truly treated BEST by the man guiding us to the shuttle bus and by the bus driver. When I flew to NYC on Jet Blue I was totally surprised and delighted, but it doesn't pay to be too optimistic about airline travel. It is at best a precarious, fine line between good and awful. Thank you for taking my review.
NEW YORK -- On January 27, 2008 flight 591 left White Plains, NY at 7:55 am. We taxied for take off and we were told we needed to return to the terminal due to a ventilation problem. We were told the problem was fixed and finally departed at 10:00 am.
We began to take off and we were in the air but not at the correct altitude. The pilot came on and said we needed to be diverted to JFK because we were still having a problem. We waited on the plane for a mechanic and we were told that the problem had been solved that the mechanic at White Plains had shut off a valve that was supposed to be open for the cabin pressure which is why we could not reach altitude for flighting. This was a commercial mechanic which was clearly stated by the pilot. We started to taxi after 2 hrs waiting and now due to weather there was a 30 plane wait and the airport was considered close due to weather.
We were given warm water to drink and the usual snacks. After waiting another 2 hrs the pilot decided to return to the JFK terminal and decide what to do with the flight. A rep from Jetblue came to the plane and said that the plane needed to be refueled and have lab checks done before the flight could leave, we must stay on the plane. This is at 2:30. We have been on this plane sine 7:30 am, people with children and older people and angry people.
We were then told we could leave the airplane but stay close by. We were told that a rep would come by and issue food coupons but we needed to leave the terminal to get the food, many people opted to stay where we were in case they decided to get the flight underway.
We were misinformed by many reps during this time regarding rescheduling and transportation back to White Plains, NY where the flight originated. We were told the flight was cancelled then we were told the flight was not and Jetblue was trying to get another plane for us because our problem was mechanical not due to weather.
At 5:00 they cancelled the flight and we waited for transportation back to White Plains. We were all advised to call the 800 number to reschedule our flights however because there were many "weather related" cancellations, we were either on hold or disconnected. Eventually we arrived back at White Plains where we were able to get a bit more assistance then at JFK's Jetblue associates.
All the passengers seemed to feel that we were being shoved around and that no one really cared if we were satisfied or not. Up till now we were satisfied with Jetblue, but this last experience was very discouraging to think that the consumer is treated so unfairly when without the consumer many of the airlines would not exist. I am following this up with Jetblue and the Better Business Bureau in our area. Thank you.
RICHMOND, VIRGINIA -- I think that reputation of JetBlue is extremely overinflated and this balloon is going to burst very soon. This 7/23/07 I had my first and now I am sure the only experience with JetBlue and I will never recommend that company to anybody again. On the contrary I will advise all my friend and relatives to stay away from this irresponsible company in order not to turn their travel in horror story.
For 2 years I, my husband and a group of friend were planning European vacation to celebrate our joint anniversary and my husband's special birthday. We booked 12 days European cruise and was supposed to stay in London for a week after. 7/23/07 our connecting flight with Delta from Richmond to JFK was delayed and we were concerned that we will not make it on time to our British Airways flight to London and will miss our ship.
So we bought a ticket on JB to JFK; and girl Angie, who sold us JetBlue seats assured us that we should run to the plane (it was ready to take off in a little more than 40 min as it was also delayed) and that she will make sure that our luggage will make it to the plane. We informed her about details of our international travel and she just told us "Run to the plane, everything will be fine, I will make sure that your luggage will be loaded on the plane".
The moment we landed to JFK I am getting a phone call from Angie, who informs me that our luggage was never picked up and that it was the last flight to NY and that there are no way we can get our luggage to NY JFK until the next day. Well, our ship was sailing the next day from London... We called our son and asked him to contact JB and to arrange delivery of our luggage to Oslo, where ship was making first stop.
I can write probably a book about not returned phone calls, about incompetence of almost every single person we were dealing with and about the fact that now, as of 9/19/07 our phone calls are still not returned, every time we are managing to get through the answer is "We will call you" and nobody calls and no single responsible person to be found. We still don't have our luggage or any compensation.
As for our travel: imagine yourself on a special vacation on the ship without any change of clothing, including the underwear (which you can't buy on the ship), without any essentials which are making your vacation comfortable and enjoyable. When you and your husband on your special day can't even enter formal dining room because you don't have an appropriate attire; when you are arriving for several hours to the capital of Denmark, where you had never been before and instead of the sightseeing and visiting museums you have to run to the local department store in search for essential underwear, shoes and clothing.
And imagine that European prices are outrageous and you feel completely ridiculous when you have to pay for the pair of pants $200, when you could buy identical in USA for $50. Plus you feel completely robbed of not only of your belonging but of your time in the wonderful city, because you ended up seeing only the store (you had to!) and you are not sure if in your lifetime you will ever have a chance to return to this city again.
By the way: I still don't have my luggage and still don't have any single person in JetBlue accepting responsibility and saying, "Yes, we will find it and will compensate you for all your troubles." All I heard only finger pointing and statements, that this is not our department who will handle this or "I am not a person who is in charge of your file, Julie is. She will call your tomorrow". Did she ever call? No. I am still waiting (for the last 7 days). So if you want to enjoy your vacation and not have any horror stories to tell, please, NEVER fly with JetBlue!
LOS ANGELES, CALIFORNIA -- Good afternoon, my name is ** and my family was scheduled on your flight #934. Our confirmation number was **. We checked on the internet before we left the house (6:00 AM) and it showed our flight was on schedule. We were traveling with 16 people. We are part of a hockey team that was scheduled for a tournament. Half of our team was on American Airlines and the other half was flying on JetBlue. The people who were on American had no problems getting to O'Hare. This meant that either we got there also or they wasted their money because you can't play an ice hockey game with just 8 players...
When we got to the airport, right around 8:00 we went to check in our luggage and we were informed that our flight had been cancelled. When we asked why, we were told they didn't know and that there was nothing we could do. We then went inside the airport to the JetBlue counter and we were again told that our flight had been cancelled and that we were on our own. We asked what could be done and they said “nothing” and then said “next” and would no longer answer our questions, just that they didn't have to do anything and didn't have any information to give us.
We tried calling your 800 number only to have a recording tell us that due to so many incoming calls you were no longer answering and that the line would be going dead and then they just hung up. We watched them work with a passenger, get him a flight on a different airline, schedule a ride for him to LAX and pay for his flight, but all 16 of us were told there was absolutely nothing they could do.
We then started calling around to all the different airlines trying to get a flight out that day as our first hockey game was Saturday at 1:00 pm. We personally had six in our family and the cheapest flight we could find at the last minutes was $305 per person one way (X 6 = $1830) on Southwest which we had to come up with right away. JetBlue credited our account the $99 that we paid for a grand total of $706. What we want to know is who is paying the additional $1,124.00?
In addition to that we had to drive to LAX and leave our car there. We also had to fly into Midway instead of O'Hare, which meant that our rental car would be no good. We had reserved a Ford Excursion (reservations were through Hertz, made with our JetBlue airline reservations) to share the cost with another family. Our share would have been $225.00, but the Hertz at Midway does not carry large vehicles so we each had to rent a mini van for $350 each. Again who is going to pay the $125.00?
Then of course there was the trip home. We got to O'Hare catch our flight and the man at the counter was so rude. We had six of us and we were allowed two bags each for a total of 12 bags at 50lbs each. However, we only had seven bags none of which were over 50 lbs.
When we went to check in he told us to use the computer to check in, which we did, however when it went to print out our boarding passes there was some error with the machine. He VERY rudely told us to us a different machine and then when we got to the front of the line to check in he told us to put all our bags on the scale at once. When we started to put them on he looked at us and VERY RUDLEY said “you have to be kidding”, slammed our tickets to us and told us to move on.
Then when we finally got on the plane (that plane was late) it was so hot I thought my daughter and I were going to pass out. It was truly the most uncomfortable 4 hours that I can remember. Then of course when we got back into Long Beach our car was in LAX. We had to hire a car to get us (6 people & 7 pieces of luggage) to LAX. Who is going to pay that $60.00?
At this point we are now out $1,421.00 because you cancelled our flight and didn't even try to help us out. We don't really care why this all happened but we are a family that has saved several months to take this trip only to have to pay out almost another $1500.00. I have no idea how we are going to do this. I would like to know when I can expect our money to be credited to our credit card? I know of another 7 families that have had the same thing happen to them and I can tell you that each and every one of us tell everyone we know how we were treated. Everyone was so rude. No one wanted to be bothered with trying to help us out.
Just so you know, back in 2002 I was the manager for my son's hockey team. We had 65 of us going to Boston. Just as we were to land in Boston they closed the airport because of weather (something that is totally out to our control). They then took us into Washington DC. When we got there we were informed that Chicago, Detroit, Boston and New York had all been closed down and moved to Washington DC. They said our flight had been cancelled and to come up to the counter to speak with a United representative.
When I got up there I explained that I had 65 people in my party and they sent us vans (at no cost to us) put us all up in a hotel, gave us dinner voucher's and then sent a car to pick us up the next day for our new flight that would be leaving at 3:00 in the afternoon. That's how you should be treating your customers.
It wasn't just the cancellation, it was the way we were treated. When we called Southwest and explained what was happening they worked with us until every person was taken care of. You should be ashamed how this was handled. I would expect to be fully refunded within the week. Very unhappy customer
Since then we were given voucher's however the vouchers claimed that they could be used towards any airfare or towards any JetBlue Vacation package. We decided to use the credit for a JetBlue Vacation package only to discover when we went to make the reservations that it can only be used towards the airfare part of the package. No where on their voucher does it say that. So we decide to book a trip to New York only to find out that the vouchers have been given in each passengers name and only those passengers can use them. Now the others in our party were our children's friends.
We did not charge them the difference in getting them to Chicago. We paid for these tickets and JetBlue will not allow us to use the vouchers for our trip. I am truly beginning to think this is all a big scam, they offer you something that you can't use, that way they look good in the news, but have no intention of treating their customer good. Every time I talk to anyone there I end up in tears. They are so rude!!! If I ever get my voucher thing worked out, that will be the last time I ever use them and like the rest of you, I will tell everyone I know about how we all have been treated...
JFK, NEW YORK -- When my wife's sister and my wife arrived at JFK airport on the 22nd of May,they found that suits case was damaged badly. We went to the baggage office immediately where we arranged to have the bag repaired. We explained to them that we would need to get the suitcase back by Friday because our passenger was leaving morning of the 26th.
The Jet Blue agent, Lilian, spoke to her supervisor. He instructed the employee who would deliver the suitcase to the repair center to wait there until the suitcase was fixed. He or she would then be able to pick up and return the suitcase to us quickly. We left the airport with the understanding that the company would contact us and deliver the suitcase. We were given "Baggage Report # which explained clearly that we would have to have the bag by Friday.
On Friday, we had not heard anything from Jetblue. So I called the office to see when we could expect to receive the suitcase back. I spoke to an agent named Miguel, who told me that he would have to check with delivery staff and call me back. After no reply for more than an hour, I called him again. He told me during this second call that he didn't think the suitcase would be delivered by the end of the day; but he would double check and call me back asap.
There was no reply at all again! I called him back and he told me that the suitcase had not even arrived at the office and it was not possible for us to receive the suitcase back that day.I explained to him that the owner of the suitcase had to leave the following morning and the suitcase needed to be sent to our passenger if they couldn't deliver it by the end of the day. He said that there shouldn't be a problem for the company to ship the suitcase. When we told him that he should have called me back sooner if he had known that we wouldn't be able to receive the suitcase back that day so that we wouldn't have had to wait at our house all day, unbelievably, he hung up.
This is the service I got from the company after dealing with this trouble.
Jetblue has done a great deal of P.R. claiming that it was restoring good service to the airline industry. Well, here's the follow-up: three weeks later, with no word from Jetblue concerning the damaged suitcase, they now after long phone queues claim that they have no record of the baggage claim that we made at the airport. They have been requested multiple times to research the problem, to locate the bag, to do anything about the problem, and they have promised each time to call us. They have never called us to inform us about the status of our claim.
Tell all your friends: JetBlue is a criminal thieving organization which has a great interest in making b.s. claims in public in order to secure their income. Their customer service has shown itself to be abominable.
I have never written a negative review before so here goes! I have never been so disappointed with a company in my life. I fly 8 months out of the year and all over the globe. I participate in numerous rewards programs and have more free flights and hotel stays than I care to think about. I often lose them because they expire before I can use them.
This is the case with JetBlue. I have 4 free flights under their "old" TrueBlue rewards program. I decided it would be fun to take the family to Florida for a week and so I went online to book my flights. Much to my disappointment I discovered that JetBlue has transitioned to a new reservations system and that I could no longer book my rewards flights online. I had to call to make the reservation.
No problem I thought and so I called. I was told that there was "higher than normal" call volume and that my call would be answered as soon as possible. I waited 45 minutes the first time, 1 hour the second time, 2 hours the third time and I am currently on hold at 3 hours and 20 minutes. I have been disconnected 4 times and possibly hung up on after finally getting through yesterday. I would have given up long ago if the rewards weren't expiring shortly! I decided to email them and this is cut and pasted from their response!
"Thank you for contacting JetBlue Airways regarding your TrueBlue account. JetBlue has just completed transitioning to a new reservation system and as a result, the TrueBlue help desk is currently receiving a high volume of email and can no longer accept them at this time. We apologize for the inconvenience. Please note: Old TrueBlue points that appear in your online account summary can not be booked through jetblue.com. To book Award travel using these old points, please call us at 1-800-JETBLUE. We value you as a JetBlue customer and apologize for any inconvenience caused from the temporary limitations we are experiencing."
BS! They aren't even accepting emails at this point! This sounds like a potential class action lawsuit to me! Virgin America here I come!
I will be brief. My trip to NY on JetBlue took a turn for the worse when JetBlue lost the luggage that had my families wedding clothes. As you could imagine this was frustrating and inconvenient. However most upsetting was their response, which was to immediately act as if either a) the bag would show up soon so there was nothing they could do or b) we had stolen the bag and were trying to scam them.
Over time, it became clear the bag wasn't showing up. They shifted almost entirely to option B, acting as if we were running a scam. As they told me many times, they have to protect their bottom line, and even though they "misplaced our bag" (going on 2 months) how do they know I (the person whose luggage was lost) is not doing this as some sort of diabolical racket.
After requiring an itemized list of goods in the bag they said they would take 45 days to respond with their decision about what to do. When that response finally came their offer was to refund approximately 35% of the value of the goods that were in the luggage. Their rational was 10% depreciation per year for every item I could find a receipt for, plus 20% off the top for any item I could not find a receipt for. In addition, any item that was priced over $100 for which I could not provide a receipt they would "depreciate" 100%! I asked, "is that a fancy way of saying you refuse to refund for such items."
Apparently it was. Although they lost my luggage while I was using their service, since I didn't save my receipt from 2004 for an item their policy is to reject reimbursement. Does anybody save receipts for that long? You can just see the number crunchers figuring out how much money they can save by denying reimbursement for such items and then making a policy to rationalize it. And from what I have seen in reviews of JetBlue, it is probably a lot of money they are saving as it sure seems like they frequently lose bags.
This has been a frustrating and insulting experience, a far cry from the customer friendly image JetBlue attempts to portray. I would suggest caution when having anything to do with them. Like many HMOs they are clearly interested in devising policies that protect their bottom line, even when they screw-up, with little concern for the well being (or continued patronage) of their customers. That is a concerning trait for an airline to exhibit. Good luck in any future contact you may have with them, I hope it is better than my experience.