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M And T Bank Is Robbing You
Posted by CP1013 on 01/28/2010
BUFFALO, NEW YORK -- For the life of me I couldn't understand what was going wrong with my checking account. In my pledge to get my finances under control this year I called the bank to find out exactly what was going wrong. To my surprise I was told by a bank representative that the bank puts a 3 day hold on your account every time you swipe your check card. In some instances, they will take the money out, put it back into your account and then take it out again. All depending on the merchant. Also, did you know that the bank will no longer decline your card if you don't have money in your account. "We do this as a courtesy to you" I was told by the bank representative A COURTESY???? Not to me.....it's a courtesy to the bank because they hit you with a $37.00 fee for insufficient funds. Was I asked that I wanted this? NO! I never agreed that it's OK for this COURTESY and I don't mind paying you $37.00 each time. Decline my friggin card. That's my choice. It's my money not yours.

M&T charged me $37.00 for being overdrawn by $2.00 then again for $.84..... Seriously?!??! How is that justified. And forget about trying to get that reversed....where is the room for human error? I was told to ditch the bank and go to a credit union where they will not charge you any fees.

Needless to say, I am reporting the bank to the Federal Reserve (not that reporting one thief to the next will do anything but you have to try).
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Posted by Anonymous on 2010-01-28:
I don't know if M and T offers this, but there's is an option that you can set a threshold for your account. And once your checking account goes below this threshold, you can opt out to have your transactions denied if you don't have the sufficient funds in your account to cover the transactions. Though, it may or may not catch everything and you can still wind up with an overdraft fee.

"Also, did you know that the bank will no longer decline your card if you don't have money in your account."

This not something new. It's been happening, for at least, 10 years or so.

This "hold" on your money... not all transactions come out at the same time. Everything is done in batches. If you use your card as debit card (you punch your pin code in), transactions should post the next business day. If you use your debit card like a credit card (you don't punch your pin code in), it takes up to 6 days to post and doesn't always show up as pending online.

"I was told to ditch the bank and go to a credit union where they will not charge you any fees."

You are misinformed. Credit Unions still charge overdraft fees if you spend more money than what's in your account.

A good way to keep your accounts on track, is to keep records of your spending. All it takes is that one check you forget about or that one purchase, to send you on a spiral of no return in overdraft fees. Whether it be a check register, keeping your receipts and doing Quicken or using your brain as your calculator... whatever.

Gone are the days of denied transactions and floating checks.

Posted by yoke on 2010-01-28:
Every time you swipe your card you should deduct the amount from your checking account. If you do that you will not get any fee's. I wish the banks would decline people's debit cards if the funds are not there, but then we would get them on here complaining that they were declined and they were only 1.00 short.
BTW, Credit Unions do charge you if you do not have the funds to cover what you spend. CU's also will close down your account faster if you continue to have NSF's.
Posted by Anonymous on 2010-01-28:
The banks call it a "courtesy" or a "service" or anything else other than what it is which is a loan in order to skirt the Truth in Lending disclosure requirements so says Bill Strunk the man who came up with the idea of letting customers overdraft their account for a fee. It's all legal chicanery.
Posted by Inat on 2010-01-28:
didnt some high schools begin teaching basic finance? Sounds like it needs to be a requirement for graduating HS. Tell kids how banks work. Tell kids that banks dont keep track of you money for you, they just hold it and distribute it for you. Tell the kids that it is their responsibility to know how much money is in their account, not the banks. I'm shocked at the number of people who do not seem to know how to work a bank account
Posted by Anonymous on 2010-01-28:
It's not just up to the school's to teach kids about finances, but there's parents as well. That's how my education on finances and bank accounts was instilled into me.
Posted by Inat on 2010-01-28:
well, parents are not always the best ones to teach their kids about finances (socia-economic status and habits are learned traits). My mom taught me what NOT to do - if i took her advice I'd be in trouble b/c she was pro at floating checks - cant do that anymroe :)
Posted by Anonymous on 2010-01-28:
I'm just saying, "there's also parents."
But, I know many parents out there that can't balance their checkbook worth a darn either.
Posted by Inat on 2010-01-28:
oh i know what you meant - anyway, if i didnt need bill pay, online banking, etc I wouldnt even use a bank. jsut pay cash for stuff - and pay your utilities at Kroger...
Posted by skelly39 on 2010-01-28:
"That's my choice. It's my money not yours."
If you made the choice to overdraft your account, then it's not really your choice if you get a fee, because it's not really your money they are using.
I wholeheartedly agree that the fees are insane and the banks will use every tactic to take as much money from you as they can. But if you make the right choices, you won't have to deal with fees. If you choose to borrow money from them, then be prepared to pay through the nose.
Posted by Anonymous on 2010-01-28:
"All depending on the merchant." Then why are you blaming the bank? Do you understand how the merchant works? I don't think you do. When you swipe your card, the banks puts a hold on the amount submitted electronically by the merchant at that time. The merchant then submits the actual charge to the bank for payment. Auths are only applied for a certain number of days. if the merchant does not submit the charge before the auth drops, the funds are placed back in your account until the charge comes through. THIS prevents an overcharge.

"Also, did you know that the bank will no longer decline your card if you don't have money in your account" This is a courtesy by the bank. If you keep a register you will always know how much money you have. Back in the day when people spent more than they had (writing checks) they went to jail for check fraud. How about the banks go back to that?
Posted by Slimjim on 2010-01-28:
Save yourself the bother of your report to the Federal Reserves. As much as Obama is slamming the big bad banks in a postured attempt to get some public support back, there is nothing illegal about charging you an overdraft fee if you, in fact, overdraft your account.
Also as said, credit unions charge overdraft fees too. I don't know where that misnomer keeps coming from.
Posted by Anonymous on 2010-01-28:
Not from the credit unions Jim, they are getting their share of the overdraft pie
Posted by Slimjim on 2010-01-28:
Got that right Ken.
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Posted by ComputerSage on 10/02/2009

I was happy with Provident Bank. I was never charged an ovedraft fee by provident bank. Provident was sold to the loan shark bank M and T. I have direct deposit, and every week I am getting slammed with "overdraft: fees for this month only I have $ 570 in ovedraft fees alone!.I deposit checks and then a partial amount is put on hold and a partial amount is made available in the "available" balance. UNlike other bank the held amount is not disclosed in online banking and neither are you told when it will be available. Different bank employees are not on the same page regarding procedures and policies. Most of the employess are rude and condesceding and treat people as if the shoulsd not be asking questions about their own bank accounts. We have a business and wanted to open a business account but we will take our business to Suntrust. There is something very sorry about the backend transactions they are performing to cause account to overdraw. I am also at a loss at how a transaction whose payment was swiped on the check card several weeks before, gets debited last that one I did last week whose amount was larger. The larger more recent transaction get processed first so that all the other smaller item wil overdrwa the acount an dthen get assesssed late fees. This is suppossed to be a free checking with direct deposit. They have it to a science since they know how much comes in every direct deposit. This bank is robbing customers and should be prosecuted .
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Posted by MSCANTBEWRONG on 2009-10-02:
Don't spend more than you have and you will avoid any type of OD fees..regardless of the order of your transactions if you spend more than you have you give the bank the opportunity to charge you tons of fees...
Posted by MaggieMcT on 2009-10-02:
The terms of your account have to tell you about holds and availability of deposits. If you don't have a copy, you need to get one asap.
Posted by Anonymous on 2009-10-02:
The Funds Availability policy is posted in every branch, and they will hand you a copy if you ask, or you could look at the copy you received when you opened the account. At a pretty quick glance you can determine the availability of any item you deposit.

A word of caution, having multiple overdrafts is a legal reason for them to extend the hold time on your deposits.
Posted by Anonymous on 2009-10-02:
You also have to be aware of how you use your card. If you use it as a debit card (you punch your pin code in), the transaction will post the next business day. If you use it as credit (you DON'T punch your pin code in), it could take up to 4 days until it posts.
Having multiple overdrafts is bad. Not only does this bank get your money, but when you deposit large checks, holds get put on them.
Posted by yoke on 2009-10-02:
I hate it when the bank takes OD fee's out for no reason.

When you make a deposit it will say on your receipt when the funds will be available. If not then ask the teller, she will tell you.
Posted by JR in Orlando on 2009-10-02:
Somehow you came up with $570.00 for overdraft fees this month. Seems like if you came up with that amount and left it in your account as a cushion, you would not have this problem with overdraft fees. Spending to the last dollar in your account, creates the risk that an overdraft will occur. Accept these are the rules, that the rules apply to you, and that you will pay if you deny reality.
Posted by TheMightyBoosh on 2009-10-02:
mscantbewrong did you even read the complaint? the poster is not spending more than she has if part of her deposits are put on hold without any indication as to when the full amount will be available. get real.
Posted by yoke on 2009-10-05:
mightyboosh, when the OP made the deposit on the deposit slip it should say when the remainder will be available. If it did not it was up to the OP to find out before spending the money.
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This is the Least Consumer Friendly I have ever encountered
Posted by SFC PBD on 07/20/2009
My Bank, Provident, was recently acquired by M&T Bank.
They are the least consumer friendly bank I have ever encountered. Today (before 1100 AM) my wife took a CASH deposit to them and was told they do not credit cash until the following day!
Additionally, I am in the military and even though I have direct Deposit they do not credit the deposit for almost 24 hours.

Do yourself a favor avoid them at all costs. They use your money for 24 hrs then charge you outlandish fees.

I will be switching banks!
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Posted by saj80 on 2009-07-20:
Per Reg CC, cash deposits are required to be credited to the account no later the one business day after the deposit is made, so the bank is legally within their right to do this. However, it doesn't make sense from a customer service viewpoint; find a small, locally owned bank and stay away from the large national banks.
Posted by Anonymous on 2009-07-20:
Don't be too quick to jump. What they are saying is that the cash will post with full availability during the same buusiness day's update. Just about every commercial bank works the same way.
Posted by fire4511 on 2011-03-24:
If you are military, you have several credit union options in the "Provident" service area.

Anything is better than "empty" (M&T)
Posted by MDSasquatch on 2011-03-24:
If you have one in your area, contact Wells Fargo and ask them about their Military Accounts; I joined them when I was on active duty and have been with them for about 6 years now. Great Bank
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This Company Really Has Terrible Customer Service
Posted by Charityb1999 on 01/31/2013
BALTIMORE, MARYLAND -- I entered the bank on January 30 2013 to cash a check; I have 2 business accounts and a personal account with M and T Bank. I signed the check and put a thumb print while waiting for the Teller.

When she came she was looking up the account and had to receive approval because of the amount of the check". This was a new account but I am not a new Customer. The other Teller comes and starts asking who the owner of the company is, where else did I try to cash the check, and treating me as if I was a thug that just came off the streets:. My check had cleared and been validated, the Teller proceeds to help other people without letting me know anything when I asked what is going on she tells me that they are working on it and she doesn't know what they are doing".

So I asked to speak to a Manager and she says the Manager is in the back working on something. After I insisted on a Manager and raised my voice then someone came from the back and guided me to the Manager, as I arrived in the Managers office she is calling the bank I opened the account with inquiring on my intentions.

I was never asked any questions; they were treating me as if I had bad intentions, without explaining or asking any clarifying questions! They didn't even research to see if I had any other accounts/.The customer service at this location is very unprofessional and the Tellers are very unhelpful, if you can go to another location or better yet go to another bank.
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Posted by leet60 on 2013-01-31:
With respect, the tellers may be limited in what they are allowed to tell you in a situation such as this. They could, perhaps, been more polite to any customer.

The bank verifying a check on what they considered a new account is not uncommon, with the amount of check fraud that is prevalent.

While I agree, they could have been more polite and professional with any customer, verifying the check was certainly not out of their normal procedures.
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Why Can't You Do What I Ask?
Posted by Tmkreiger on 01/25/2013
I called the bank to tell them to stop payment on a product I cancelled two months ago. They keep billing me. I said to stop payments to them and got the runaround that they cannot stop electronic payments. What is so hard about this? Just stop paying the hydroxatone people. Don't let them take any more money out of my account. What is so hard about this? Just block them. Jeeze
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Posted by Obsfucation on 2013-01-25:
Here's what's so hard. When a block is placed, they have to specify exactly what to block, things like originator number, dollar amount, description, source, among others. All the Hydroxotone company has to do is change a variable each time, and it will slide right through. They know this and take full advantage of it.

Have you signed a stop payment form for this company? That's the first thing you must do. A vedrbal request is not sufficient. If you have stopped payments, you are within your rights to have them returned, but you still may have to monitor and request a return when it happens.
It is a great deal more difficult to get the kind of payments turned off on a debit card than it is on a credit card, and is th eprimary reason for not using a debit card on this type of deal.
Posted by trmn8r on 2013-01-25:
Automatic electronic withdrawals are very dangerouus. I grant this to only my power company and my telephone company (a landline - very predictable bills).

From 5 minutes of research (very brief), it appears that a bank should block a recurring charge if they are given oral or written notice 3 days or more prior to the scheduled transaction. If they let it through, you should be able to get it back.

However, it appears that if the company changes the name on the transaction, it could go through anyway. I imagine they would have to change the account it is transferring to as well, but I don't know.

Your last option appears to be a hard block on debits, which could be hard and take weeks to implement if you have others set up. Good luck - that is a nasty problem.

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Cant Get a Payoff Amount
Posted by on 08/06/2012
My son called in for the payoff on his truck. They can discuss the account status but can't give him the amount. So he calls me 2700 miles away. I call and I get we can't give you that amount without the VIN number to verify the loan is the right one. I only have one with them and never a freaking again. DONT GET A LOAN WITH THEM. They tell you can get info on line. NOT ON AN AUTO LOAN why is it the only one you can't get. HMMMM they are the people they can scam more......................... My mom was to be the co-signer, but she is the only one on the loan. I have complained for 5 years and they say it will show on my credit that I paid this loan. NOT
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Posted by DebtorBasher on 2012-08-06:
I'm a little confused here...the truck belongs to your son, the loan is under YOUR name (his parent) but your Mother (Your Son's Grandmother) is the co-signer? Do I have that right?
Posted by Susan on 2012-08-06:
If the auto loan is in your mother's name only then that is most likely the only person they will give account information to, such as the payoff amount. And since the loan is in her name under her social security number there is no way that the payments can be reflected on your credit report. Finally, requesting the VIN number seems pretty reasonable to me.
Posted by trmn8r on 2012-08-06:
I'm with DebtorBasher, who is a pleasant companion if you must have one. It sounds like three generations are involved.

I'd like to believe that if the person who signed for this loan were to call, and provide the information needed to identify themself and the car, they could obtain the information sought.
Posted by jonthethird on 2012-08-06:
the payoff on my vehicle note is on every statement
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Excessive ATM Fees
Posted by Rayprugh on 08/03/2012
BALTIMORE, MARYLAND -- Apparently the bank, in their usual manner, issued a notice in small letters at the bottom of a statement that they were to charge a fee for each and every ATM withdrawel over 4 per statement period (1 month). I still haven't found that notice! This fee was to be $5.00 per transaction. This is in addition to the $2.50 fee if you use another banks ATM.

In July my wife used the ATM 20 times to acces HER money so M&T charged her $80.00 in fees. During the same oeriod they paid he $.01 in interest. It looks to me like they want to penalize you to keep YOUR money where THEY can have access to it to use as they see fit. When I called them I was told TOO BAD no refunds for you. That is why by September 1st the account will be closed and in another bank that appreciates my business.
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Posted by Bill on 2012-08-03:
M and T has to make up the money they paid to acquire Wilmington Trust last year. If you want free atm use you have to sign up for the premiere account or whatever it's called and it only applies to M and T atms.
Luckily I was a customer with Wilmington Trust before and we were grandfathered in according to a teller so I don't think M and T and can start hitting us with fees.
If they do it will be time to look for a new bank or credit union.
Posted by trmn8r on 2012-08-03:
Reading those disclosures is extremely important, as you found out. My guess is indeed there was such a notice - banks are required to send them.

Banks have scrambled in the last year to find new ways of making money because of certain changes in fees they can no longer charge. I think everyone realizes at the end of the day they have to be profitable. However, fees like this can be shocking because if you aren't aware of them you can get whacked like you did.

It does cost money to provide and maintain ATMs. Limiting customers to 4 withdrawals a month is reasonable IMO. Of course I would NEVER pay $4 to use an ATM, so I would make sure not to go over 4. I also would NEVER use an out of network ATM. Avoiding bank fees can be very profitable for us as consumers. Good luck with your new bank.
Posted by bob932304 on 2012-08-03:
Want free ATM withdrawals - join a credit union. Some minimums are $100 for checking, some are only $5.
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Condescending connivers
Posted by Samuelsondoug on 07/11/2012
VIRGINIA -- I have automatic payments from my checking account to an overdraft line. Since M&T bought the bank I used, there seems to be endless creativity in finding ways to maneuver the customer into a late fee or service charge. I have a couple of carefully documented instances in which the bank took a larger payment than the billed amount. If I pay directly, in cash,. less than 72 hours before the automatic payment is scheduled to come out, the payment "doesn't count," it takes the automatic payment anyway, and if my checking account balance won't cover the payment, I get an overdraft fee. The bank will not take available money from the overdraft line to cover this type of overdraft. Paying cash into the checking account the day the payment is due also will not cover a potential overdraft, as the bank does not consider a cash deposit available until the next business day. Their so-called "customer service" reps treat complaints and appeals on these subjects as if I were a petulant five-year-old. When I pointed out to one of them that the bank's practices are quite likely illegal, she laughed at me and hung up. I fervently hope that one of these days they will lose a huge class action lawsuit for this crap. I understand it wouldn't be the first class action lawsuit they've lost over confusing and exploitive fees. Forget 'em!
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Posted by trmn8r on 2012-07-11:
The things that you describe sound standard to me, at other banks as well.

Automatic payments need to be cancelled days in advance to be sure they are actually cancelled. And I don't know if you can cancel a single payment without cancelling the periodic transfer altogether.

Depositing the same day to cover a debit often doesn't work either. The trick is to keep a buffer in your account to cover impending debits - incurring overdrafts just isn't worth it.
Posted by Mark on 2012-12-21:
This is the worst bank hands down
Posted by Al braden on 2013-02-14:
M and t has robbed me the same way. Just last month they hit me wit 9 overdraft fees using the same practices. I am looking for others and will file a class action suit.
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The Worse Bank is M and T Bank
Posted by Rangergreedstrong on 06/07/2012
M and T Bank is a rip off. The online bill pay system process a payment before the date that I have setup to make a payment that cause my account another overdraft. M and T Bank can KISS MY A** YOU SONS OF BUTCHES.
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Posted by trmn8r on 2012-06-07:
When you called and asked for an explanation of how this can happen, what were you told?

The best offense with banks is a good defense and not falling pray to the same fees twice. Off the top, I don't know why this would happen, except possibly if a weekend were involved. I don't use "bill pay" so I wouldn't know.
Posted by Delaware on 2012-07-07:
I use to love my bank, Then M and T took over now I'm always in the hole with them!! I'm looking for another bank on Monday can't stand M and T scam big time!!!!
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Worst of the Worst
Posted by Eksanimo on 06/07/2012
AUBURN, NEW YORK -- Well a friend gave a check today from M&T Bank and I went to cash it and they said no account here, YOU PAY us $10.00 fee to cash our check !! Ha ! This is why I dumped this bank 8 years ago. They are not user friendly they are bilkers of the masses, who bait and switch, hide fees no other banks even dare to charge. They prey on the weak and vulnerable. GO TO ANY LOCAL BANK OR CREDIT UNION, THIS PLACE (M&T BANK) IS JUST A WARREN BUFFET SCAMMER BANK.
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Posted by clutzycook on 2012-06-07:
So why not take it to your bank? Just so you know, any other bank would charge you to cash the check if you did not have an account with them.
Posted by trmn8r on 2012-06-07:
I find it interesting that you state "go to any local bank".

My "local" bank, a regional one, charges for such a transaction. I know BoA does. I'd be interested in knowing of a bank that doesn't.

I don't know if a credit union will perform a check cashing service for non customers or not...
Posted by Anonymous on 2012-06-07:
Agree with Clutzy. Every time I read one of these complaints, I wonder why the OP wouldn't just go to their own bank in the first place? Maybe its just me but I prefer to go to my credit union, especially after the experience I had with BofA trying to cash a check drawn on one of their accounts.
Posted by Churro on 2012-06-07:
Again the SERVICE provided is for the check writer not the check casher.

Ask and ye shall receive. Here's four local banks off the top of my head that don't charge to cash checks drawn on their bank.

Arvest Bank
First National Bank in Midwest City
Tinker Federal Credit Union
Communications Federal Credit Union
Posted by Churro on 2012-06-07:
Samanthasmom, You realize if you deposit a check in your account and it bounces you could get hit with a fee from your bank? That's a good reason why people redeem checks at the banks they were written on.
Posted by clutzycook on 2012-06-07:
Hopefully the odds of that happening are pretty slim. Otherwise, you have some pretty lousy friends. In any case, I would take my chances and if I did get dinged, I'd go after the check writer for the fee.

But if you're that worried about it, only accept cash.
Posted by Churro on 2012-06-07:
Only accept cash from people who choose to do business with a bank that won't offer the service of redeeming your check without hitting the person you wrote the check to with a fee.
Posted by CowboyFan on 2012-06-07:
Two things that immediately come to mind is that a person without an account increases the risk of a fraudelent or altered check. The bank cashes the check, but the person is long gone when the check is found not to have been written by their customer (or altered). Also, cashing checks cost the bank money (versus deposits), but banks do it because it builds up customer relations with "their customers." Someone who has no accounts but wants to cash a check, cost them money, but provides no future benefit to the bank.
Posted by madconsumer on 2012-06-07:
very helpful comments churro!!!!!!
Posted by Churro on 2012-06-07:
Helpful is what I aim for.
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