My husband and I bought into a timeshare after renting a room at one of the Wyndham Resort properties. We enjoyed the stay and the facility was nice. We should have kept renting on a per pay basis. Now we have a monthly payment and maintenance fee. We have approximately 4 days of use a year and we usually have to divide that between rooms because we are not able to get rooms for 4 days together. That means we spend 2 nights in one room and then have to check out and wait until 3 to check into the next room for the last 2 days. They do not go out of their way to accommodate the traveler.
We work and have limited time to use these days which are never the days that are available except for a few places which dictate where we travel. The program is for people who have a lot of time to accommodate Wyndham's needs. If you can't plan a year in advance I would strongly suggest you think twice before entering into the arrangement. Once you are in you are stuck. It is the worse financial investment I have ever made. Shame on me for not using better judgment. I would strongly recommend if you like the Wyndham properties just rent them as you would another hotel. This is a long term relationship you don't want to get into!
NEW ORLEANS, LOUISIANA -- We went for a timeshare presentation because my husband believed the phone solicitation/phone pitch, which was we would receive free flights. We went to the presentation and were polite, stayed almost four hours not the two they told us would be required.
Toward the end when it became apparent to our salesperson that we had no intention of buying, things turned dark. She said, "Why did you come to this presentation? We all know nothing is free." I wanted to say, "So... you got us here under false pretenses?" Yes, we could pay cash for their timeshare. But... Even the New Orleans one was cheesy, pedestrian. We told them it just wasn't us.
Our person kept up with the subtle and not so subtle jabs. Please never fill out another card and put someone through a presentation if you don't intend on buying because this is how she pays her bills. "Please let me get you out of here so I can get another customer." I asked if she had a card. She said she only gave her card to people who buy from her, otherwise she didn't want us to have her number! What? Maybe I wanted to have it in case we changed our minds or to give to another customer who would like their program. Really ill-mannered!
PHOENIX, ARIZONA -- We reserved a two-night, paid stay at this facility as convenient to the purpose of our stay in Phoenix. The rate for the stay was comparable to other places in the area, but the accommodations were substandard and dated. We were invited to a "presentation" (we all know what that's all about) but declined as our schedule didn't allow the time.
In addition to the room being dated, the ice machine for the couple of dozen rooms in our complex did not work and appeared it had not not worked for some time. It was reported, but not fixed. The pipe to the showerhead was leaking (likely back into the wall) and the base of the showerhead sprayed water on the walls and over the tub enclosure. Neither sink in the bathroom held water, and up to three minutes elapsed while waiting for hot water. The small closet door for hanging clothes could not be opened and it was obvious by deep scratches in the tile floor this was not a new problem. The refrigerator cycled off and on 24 hours, and was annoying.
To top it all off, we found a cockroach on the floor after the first night's stay. Some time ago we experienced the cleanliness issue at a Wyndham "resort" in Flagstaff. The purpose of this information is to further alert Wyndham management and consumers. On the plus side, hats off to the grounds crew!!!
DESTIN, FLORIDA -- September 2014 went to Texas State Fair and Wyndham had a presentation for timeshare. They offered a 3 day 2 night stay at Riverwalk San Antonio for $100. We would "only" have to go to a 1 hour presentation once we arrived. It was a high pressure sale experience. We wound up buying a Discovery package. This we could use one time without commitment. Advance forward.
Now we are at their resort in Destin Beach. We went to a breakfast welcoming us here. Which of course it is nothing more than a repeat of San Antonio. They try to play this shame game, good cop bad cop deal. Horrible experience. No we didn't buy their crap! Staying in a room with no view or balcony. Tried to upgrade but we're told not available. Trust me it is empty this time of year. The sales staff said the better rooms were for members and we just didn't qualify. This company is horrible! I could go on and on. I would never ever stay at anything associated with Wyndham.
DESTIN, FLORIDA -- This notice applies to Wyndham / PayPal worldwide. Be aware that if you use PayPal to finance any purchases regarding timeshares, whether it's the timeshare itself or more points/weeks (Wyndham does this), if at some future date you rid yourself of the timeshare, you may still have to pay PayPal any monies owed from timeshare purchases. This could amount to 1000's of dollars depending on your balance. And of course, your Wyndham sales representative will never tell you this at a sales beating...sorry, I meant...meeting!! (They are very good @ lies of omission / non-disclosure. If the customer doesn't know anything about it, don't tell them!)
So, NEVER, EVER use PayPal or similar companies to finance timeshare anything purchases. One other item: according to street rumor that if you buy a timeshare and a hurricane comes through and wipes the place out, and it costs $xx million in repairs, and Wyndham insurance will only cover $x million, you as a owner for that resort is on the hook financially for sharing the remaining $x million cost of repairs! Think about it!!!
ALEXANDRIA,& SAN ANTONIO, TEXAS -- I originally purchased a timeshare at Governor's Green in Williamsburg through Wyndham Resort properties in 2008 after my husband had passed away. I was satisfied with what I had been sold because I was a VIP member with special privileges. Lie #1. I am not certain what special privileges I received but I was told when sitting through another sales pitch two years later that I would have to pay extra from then on for use of my points and I would have to make reservations well in advance or wait until the last moment to see what had become available by owners not taking their weeks.
This of course made it virtually impossible to plan adequately for a vacation with friends as I had envisioned when I signed on. I was never told this nor was I ever told that the RCI brochure full of beautify photographed resorts all over the world cost extra and were, by and large, unavailable. Also no mention was made of maintenance fees. I learned of those when I reviewed my contract much later. Of course they had taken a copy of a cancelled check and had set up an automatic monthly transfer of any amount they so determined.
At the second resort, in Alexandria, Virginia in Nov. 2010, I brought along three friends for a weekend in the city. I was told that I needed to schedule an update with one of the Wyndham Representatives-no mention of SALES REP--to review my plan and to learn of all the good things happening at Wyndham. I should have run the other way right then. I was escorted into a room at the back of the hotel and was immediately set upon by a bullying, hard hitting sales person. (I was told I would only need to be in the room about 30-45 minutes for the presentation by the person who had set up the appointment.) I had told my friends to go on and I would meet them in that time period.
Well, hours later after being bullied into signing a contract that I had stated at the beginning that I could not afford I emerged shell shocked and wondering what I had done. Over the course of the next month I learned that I had signed papers that opened a charge card for me and that Wyndham had put $5000 on it without my express permission. Not once was I ever told that I had opened a charge card or that Wyndham had put the money on it. I was not given time to review any of the documents and was told by the salesperson that it was for a RCI rewards card. I thought he meant a card with a number to used to access my RCI account.
I learned the truth when I received the first bill in the mail from Bank of America. I immediately called them to ask what was this/ I never opened an account with you. They told me the truth and said there was nothing they could do because I had signed the papers even if under duress. When I returned home after my trip I did call Wyndham and complained about the sales person and they seemed very sympathetic and said they would send my complaint to a special department and they would get back to me. They never did. I also told them that I could not afford the new program and I did not want it and they told me to send it all back.
The only response that I got from them was a form letter explaining that they had received the contract too late and I would therefore have to pay. Needless to say I was extremely unhappy. They were essentially robbing me of my meager inheritance making life for me less secure than I had hoped. Next, and I know I should have learned from that experience, I went to San Antonio, TX with a friend to her timeshare. Same deal as at Alexandria--she needed to meet briefly with the Wyndham Reps for "Updates". I was asked if I would like to come along and I related my bad experience with them and state unequivocally that I could not afford anything else.
They both commiserated with me and assured me that I should come along and I would be nothing but ecstatic about the with what they could do to fix my problems. Of course, I thought that I was going to return to the original plan--not so. We were kept in their offices for the better part of the day and were fed one lie after another. We were told that there would be no maintenance fees. They would be taken care of with points we would earn each month with the submission of six names for prospective sales talks. I discovered this lie when I returned home after visiting relatives for a month and the bill for $3000 awaited me.
We were told that we could make money by returning all unused points and they would be converted to weeks to be rented out at only their best 25 Wyndham Resorts. All we ever needed to do was call **--one of the reps and he would take care of us because he would be our personal assistant/representative. We were told always call ** first. Trouble was, I was later told that ** was not my representative and the other one, **, never was available and never returned my calls. My friend has stayed with the program and has yet to see any money from any rentals.
I asked repeatedly for things I had been assured that I could get because of my membership status and got not the first perk or rental that I wanted. We were told that there would be no more assessment fees and I just received a bill for just that thing. There are so many more falsehoods that I could list. I have read many other reviews and much of what I have read I have experienced with this company. I have been to several of their resorts, two were roach infested--the one at San Antonio and the one at Edisto Beach, SC. one charged additional fees--in spite of the fact that we pay exorbitant maintenance fees each month.
I discovered when I first tried to use points that I had banked with RCI so that I would not lose them that I had to pay even more to them and many of those beautiful resorts that are in the glossy magazine are unavailable. The one in Maine was quite small but was by far my best experience. The one in Mont Tremblant was filthy with threadbare furniture and window hangings. You dared not put your hand down into the seats because of the filth. The manager was rude and nasty. When I complained about the additional fee he had tacked onto the rentals, he told me to get out if I didn't like it. This after I had driven two days with three friend to get there.
The equipment was old, broken and unsafe. My friend was almost thrown from the bicycle that she had chosen. It was the best of them all. We almost drowned in their poorly designed boats. They don't explain in the brochure that you are along a major highway or that it's noisy. I have sent Wyndham two letters stating all my complaints and also told them that I could not afford to pay for this timeshare. I have only a small amount of money left and if forced to pay for this I shall be reduced to filing for bankruptcy. I asked them to sell the timeshare or let me out of the contract because of their deceptive, pernicious, and predatory practices.
I have no savings, no securities, no home ownership, no nothing except my personal belongings. I have heard not one word from Wyndham. All I get are bills, bills, bills, and threats. I have contacted a lawyer and have been following his advice, but I fear that while well meaning, he is of not much value. I have submitted complaints to the FTC, the AG of Arkansas, the Better Business Bureaus in San Antonio, and others. I shall continue to make my complaints heard because no person should be subjected to such practices. I do have a witness and she too is attempting to get out of her contract and is willing to testify to what happened to us in San Antonio.
We went to the Wyndham Vacation resort sales pitch in San Antonio.... WHAT A JOKE! I will start by saying that we got there and they give you a form to fill out "to save time on the sales pitch". This form asked for all your personal information, i.e. name, address and SSN... REALLY?! There was a disclaimer that you would give Wyndham permission to run your credit. I stopped right there and took that paper with me, there is no way I am going to give my SSN out, there is no reason for them to have it. Well the deception started... everyone was friendly and willing to give us the BEST VACATION DEAL EVER! Well, we went in knowing we were not going to buy anything.
We were just fulfilling our 90 minute sales pitch obligation, which they would give us a $200 gift card at the end. Luckily the sales office was 5 minutes away from the hotel where we were staying. The sales person started with six question to figure out how we like to travel. How long we travel, etc. I am a 4 day 3 night type of vacationer. I don't like to be away from home much more than that, I am ready to get home and sleep in my own bed at that point. The sales person looked at me a little funny because I said that, oh well! Then the sales person was going to "price out" my future vacations... this is so off when it comes to numbers.
A few of the destinations we could stay with friends a few night, so that in itself saves money. Well, the sales person did not want to count that so we had to give another destination....whatever. Talk, talk, talk.... then the 10 minute video was shown to us, boring and seems liked hired actors. The "families" didn't even look like they could be related. From the beginning we got a feeling that this was all a SCAM. But we listened. Then after the video, we were shown how much taking a vacation over the next 30 years would cost. Mind you, the sales person used 7 days, when I told them we go for 4 days 3 nights... let's compare apples to apples shall we? Not in their case...
The figure they came up with was 130K for the 30 year period...ha ha! I also let them know that I have a lot of connections in the travel and hospitality business so I didn't pay full price for things and if you shop around you can get better deals. Then we were taken to the property to view the rooms. They were nice, but everyone vacations differently. The rooms were over the top and just not what we needed. Well at the end the sales person was going to ask me if I wanted to sign up, to say YES or NO. Oh, I forgot to mention that I told the sales person once we got there, we were buying a house... the sales person didn't seem overly concerned.
There is no way I was going to jeopardize my home for some crazy time share. The sales person closed with well, it will be 25% down, around 16K and how would you like to pay for that? People have lost their mind... Then when we said NO, they did the obvious, T. O. (turnover) I knew that was coming. The "manager" came over and said "so how do we get you signed up?" I told him the same thing that we were buying a house and didn't want my credit run or jeopardize my future home. The sales manager did not care. He came with a cheaper option. The first option was $68,000 for 308,000 points and the second option was 64,000 the sales manager lost his mind.
When I say NO, I mean No. Then the sales manager had the gall to interrogate us about our home purchase. Who is your realtor? I said, "what? I am sorry but that is none of your business." Then went off to say that he sold homes before, so he could help. Then was asked who is your builder and not nicely, more in like you better tell me. HE offended me by the way he felt entitled to interrogate us at this point said "do you not understand that we are not going to buy anything?" As he and I both knew that this was a no obligation to buy sales pitch. That we completed our end of the deal by coming here and we said NO. He got annoyed and said "let's get you checked out."
They are nuts selling something for so much money and when we told them we go on vacations when we can and it's normally for 4 days and 3 nights. If we can drive we do. They try to pressure you to buy, their Jedi mind tricks did not work. It goes back to the old saying, "if it's too good to be true..." I am strong willed and when we got there we were not going to buy a thing. We did get our $200 AMEX gift card and enjoyed spending it a lunch.
The sales pitch was actually 2 hrs not 90 minutes. Just a warning, if the Wyndham sales team are so desperate to sell and feel they have the right to interrogate you because you chose not to buy, just imagine how they will treat you when you become a member and have an issue... no thanks!
After buying two Wyndham timeshares and listening to several other presentations, I believe I can offer useful advice on listening to a timeshare presentation. The first thing that will happen is your salesperson will ask some general questions to get you to talk about your travel and vacation habits, what are your likes and dislikes, and any personal info they can glean. They use this to tailor their presentation to amplify the things you like and answer or avoid your dislikes. You won't even notice this manipulation. This is not dishonest, it is just how selling is done.
For example, my wife mentioned that she was disappointed that the salesperson we bought our first timeshare from never followed up; our second salesman ** soon began to say how he liked to keep in touch with his "thousand owners" and keep them appraised of events; how his owners always liked to call. When he stepped away for a minute, another salesperson came over to tell us how fortunate we were to have such an attentive salesman as **, all his owners just loved his followthrough. It was all an act, of course.
After we bought, he did not follow through on anything. We called him once for an explanation of something he told us that was a flat lie; he said he was busy and would call right back. We never heard from him again. Lesson: the salesman is not your friend; before the sale you are a potential source of income; after the sale, you are an irritating waste of his time.
This is very important: the only completely truthful things you will hear are those few facts that will be in writing on the two dozen documents you will sign if you buy. Everything else will be half truths or outright lies. The timeshare product is made deliberately complicated, and is full of qualifications, rules, policies, exceptions and practices that make your benefits less than you were led to believe. The purpose is to make you want to buy more points to fill in the deficiencies. You will be continually dismayed later as nothing is how you thought.
A few examples: they said our points were good for a year. We were surprised to be told seven months later that our points were soon to expire. They never revealed the first year was only nine months, and were quite happy to let us believe the year would be 12 months. We got bonus points from the first timeshare, good for two years (but only one year nine months as it turns out), and more bonus points for our second timeshare. I added the two together, and our salesman was only too happy to show us all the places we could go with that many points.
He knew, but didn't tell us, that the second bonus points were to be delayed 10 months until the first bonus points expired, so they couldn't be added together. There will be many, many such qualifications that they know but will not reveal without a direct question.
When points are about to expire, you transfer them to RCI, which converts them into weeks that you can book at any RCI resort. Sounds great and your salesman will spend a lot of time showing you the great resorts. That much is true. What he won't tell you is that there is so much demand, that you will be calling to get on a waiting list for 18 to 24 months in advance for nice resorts in season. And you have to pay the transaction fee up front. And if you fail to get the booking, you've just lost a year or two on the life of your week. No wonder they conceal it.
Here's a more serious example. We couldn't swing the second timeshare, as I asked if we might recoup some of the money by renting out our week in Orlando over Christmas. ** showed us Christmas room rates for resorts nearby that were astonishingly high, enough to recoup half our purchase price. Now we own and have the Christmas week booked, but we find we will be lucky to get a fifth of what we expected. I think he was showing us the posted rates for those other resorts.
You know, when you stay at a $49 Motel 6, and on the back of the door the posted rate for the room is $215. He knew we were never going to get those numbers, but was quite happy to nudge us into believing whatever would get him the sale. Unfortunately, It was this prospect of covering half our purchase price that sold me.
Think they will not tell an outright lie? Wyndham offers what they call Party Weekends, where you get two or three days at a top resort, a meal or two, and some top rated entertainment like a Knicks game or tickets to a pro golf tournament. ** said "and for VIPs, they are FREE". For the very top entertainment, "they might charge $100, but mostly they are free. But you are limited to three per year." This one thing sold my wife, but it was a deliberate lie. Party Weekends go for $700 and up, most of them over $1,000.
Before you go to your first presentation, go to eBay and search for "wyndham timeshares". You will find many for sale at one fifth or less that the price from Wyndham. Why so low? With the annual fees and taxes, the inconveniences, the hidden qualifications and conditions, it's not really that good a deal. Remember, as a Wyndham salesmen told me last week as he tried to sell me more points, "points are points, it doesn't matter what home resort they are from." If you think you might like timeshare, get one on eBay for $500 and see how you like it.
Many years ago we purchased timeshares on the secondary market on Kauai. A few years later Wyndham purchased some of the Pahio property and managed the rest. They harassed us for years to flip to Wyndham. We finally gave in. But they still will not leave us alone. Each and every year we have to attend an owner presentation. It is just another sales pitch to sell us more points. The properties in most demand are very hard to get into. There are more loopholes and rules to navigate that the most educated are overwhelmed by all the non user friendly language.
DO NOT INVEST IN EITHER WYNDHAM OR IN MARRIOTT PROPERTIES. YOU WILL NEVER GET YOUR MONEY OUT OF THEM. THEY ARE RIPOFFS. The best timeshare property we have found is on Kauai called "the Cliffs." It is extremely budget conscience with a 6 star rating. It is locally managed and awesome. It is a beautiful property for those who want Kauai every year.
On 22 August 2010, we purchased 154,000 Wyndham Points from Mr. ** at Wyndham Grand Desert. Based upon that initial meeting, we subsequently purchased another 146,000 points (for a total of 300,000 points) on 2 October 2010. Also on 22 Aug 2010, Mr. ** promised 2 “free” weekends at the Grand Desert with tickets to a “show of our choice” each stay—haven't seen them yet. Prior to our return trip to Las Vegas on 2 Oct 2010, Mr. ** and I discussed the room and the show tickets. We specifically requested Blue Man Group; Mr. ** assured me all was taken of; he said, “Don't worry; I'll take care of everything.”
It wasn't until after arrival that I found out that he would not pick up the entire cost of both the room and the show tickets; we decided that we would pay for the tickets and Mr. ** would take care of the room. After that weekend I noticed that we were charged 37,100 points for our stay. I worked with Mr. ** on multiple occasions to correct the error. Finally, he stated that he was unable to return the points. He subsequently sent us a coupon for one week. However, the times and places that were available were unrealistic. So, not only did we have to pay for the BMG tickets, Wyndham charged us 37,100 points for the privilege to be lied to more.
Mr. ** also directed us to apply for an RCI Elite Rewards MasterCard issued by Bank of America, with a 6-month introductory APR of 2.9%, to make our initial Wyndham Properties ownership purchase. He further directed us at the 5-month point to apply for the Wyndham Rewards VISA issued by Barclays Bank Delaware, with a 6-month APR of 0.0%, and transfer the balance from the RCI MasterCard to the Wyndham VISA. He failed to inform us there was a transfer fee that would have negated any savings that might have been realized from the lower interest rate. But this small fact is beside the point.
The real issue is that Mr. ** described that by financing the ownership purchase at such low rates for the first 12 months, he'd assist us in renting our points (at 100% return) during this time, in effect having our ownership “pay for itself” before we had to pay the purchase loan off. Another conversation that we had with Mr. ** on 22 Aug 2010 that lead us to buy was that he told us his family rents out their points and makes money “hand over fist.” And, Mr. ** stated that occasionally he comes across points being sold at significantly reduced cost: like “$7,000 for 150,000 points.”
I told him I would be extremely interested in increasing my ownership point holdings if we could purchase additional points at that kind of discount. On or about 15 Sep 10, Mr. ** called and said he had more points for us—he never specified the dollar amount. Then when we came in on 3 Oct 2010, I was expecting significantly discounted points. He said he didn't have any of those at that time, but that he could offer us the same “discounted” deal that he had given us on 22 Aug 2010.
I specifically said, “I am not convinced that we got a good deal the first time.” He assured us we did, stating that 150,000 points typically retail for $60,000. This does not appear to be the case according to the research I've completed. We now have cause to believe Mr. ** sold us Wyndham ownership based upon false pretense. He sold us Wyndham ownership as an investment and explained how we would make money by renting our points. During his sales presentation, Mr. ** presented a copy of a Wyndham property invoice from Travelocity showing a room that had recently rented for $10,000 per weekend.
Mr. ** provided us his business card and told us to call him any time for assistance. After a few calls with no response, I then called Wyndham and left a message. He then called me and said it would take at least 24 hours for him to respond. He never returns calls. We specifically mentioned we were not interested in vacationing with Wyndham as they do not have properties for the types of vacations we typically take.
Both PC and the Lead Sales Presenter jokingly mentioned that we had a point; that they ought to make a testimonial video of us as the “types of vacationers Wyndham represents.” There was a witness; the sales lady sitting next to us was privy to our conversations. ** even asked her, "Can you believe the trips these people have taken." On 2 Oct 2010, Mr. ** promised to rent all our points for us with 100% profit coming to us. To date, this process has not worked as described by Mr.**.
We are extremely disappointed because we have followed Mr. **'s instructions, attempted to rent our points through the program offered by Wyndham, but have had completely unsatisfactory results. Subsequently, we voiced our displeasure to Mr. ** and on two occasions Mr. ** assured me that he could sell our ownership. Once on 2 Apr 11, I asked Mr. ** if he could sell our ownership. He said, “Yes, I always have people looking for more points.” I told him I wasn't looking to make a profit. He said, “I will get you a profit, you always want to make a profit.” He then told me call him in 3 weeks.
On 26 Apr 11, Mr. ** told me that he had a buyer and to call him on Tuesday or Wednesday next week; he told me that he was going to be in Los Angeles. I told him I would meet him for lunch to finalize the sale of the Wyndham Ownership. He told me that wasn't necessary that he would be able to handle the transaction by telephone. I have attempted to contact Mr. ** multiple times, to no avail. I also called Mr. ** and asked him to have ** call me; I also called the Wyndham Sales Department and left a message. I informed the lady that took the message that I have left multiple messages and she assured me that she would have Mr. ** call me.
As of 19 Apr 11, there has been no call from Mr. **. Mr. ** has failed to follow through with selling our points and terminating our ownership in Wyndham. Mr. **'s recent actions seem to continue a pattern of deceit. It should be noted that on our sales paperwork, Mr. ** specifically instructed us to identify “convenience, value, and property selection” and not “investment” as our reason for purchase. On 20 May 11, the Wyndham “Executive Management Team” informed us that there was no basis for our complaint, that since it wasn't in writing it wasn't valid. Does that mean Verbal Contracts are not valid in Nevada?
We bought into Mr. **'s pitch that we could make money; I no longer believe that is true. We are out $50k based on his deceitful sales practice. That money was taken from our retirement fund; with no foreseeable potential to "make" any money to supplement our retirement.